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Can being in Ketosis prevent influenza?

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    Posted: June 01 2006 at 9:26am
Can being in Ketosis prevent influenza?

Just out of curiousity, I am a follower of the Dr. Atkins (low carbohydrate) diet.  I have been on and off of it for 35 years now, and know that it works (if I stick to it). 

I have been thinking back, and I can not remember ever coming down with the flu while on the diet.  I have had the flu, but (I believe) always while eating normal food (and quickly getting fat as my body stores excess carbs quite well.)

For those of you who have been in ketosis and were tracking it, have you ever come down with the flu during the time you were in ketosis?  Perhaps having ketones in the bloodstream and being exhaled from your lungs kills or weakens the virus?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2006 at 9:28am
Another good question? Any medical people around?

See, this is why I can't seem to get off this forum and get some work down around here. LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frisky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2006 at 12:12pm
  I have no idea if a mild state of ketosis could have a protective effect against acquiring a viral illness. My thoughts are that the concentration of ketones is too low to be protective. I do know that if you get an injury or illness while in a depleted state mortality and morbidity stastics go up. Also ketones are fairly strong diuretics which is not good in cases where volume depletion may be an issue.     ER Doc   An addendum note: Diabetics who get flu have a 6 times higher rate of hospitalization and a 3 times higher mortality after controlling for all other factors.   ER Doc
It is better to give than to receive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2006 at 1:25pm
Thank you Frisky. I sure am glad that you are around here!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2006 at 6:44pm
Correct me if I am wrong ketosis can lead to acidosis? Does the avian flu live in a an acidic blood chemistry? How dangerous is this to the kidneys?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2006 at 11:24pm
Originally posted by Frisky Frisky wrote:

  I have no idea if a mild state of ketosis could have a protective effect against acquiring a viral illness. My thoughts are that the concentration of ketones is too low to be protective. I do know that if you get an injury or illness while in a depleted state mortality and morbidity stastics go up. Also ketones are fairly strong diuretics which is not good in cases where volume depletion may be an issue.     ER Doc   An addendum note: Diabetics who get flu have a 6 times higher rate of hospitalization and a 3 times higher mortality after controlling for all other factors.   ER Doc


Apparantly you are one who has accepted the misleading statements of the AMA as regards nutrition.  Being in ketosis is not a depleted state.  It is quite normal and I feel very, very healthy. I understand and appreciate your concern.

Being in ketosis because of selectivity in diet is not the same as a diabetic individual who is yo-yoing from too little sugar in the blood stream to too much. The fluctuation is damaging as is the presence of too much sugar.

As I am certain you are aware, people on the Dr. Atkins diet limit their carbs until they are in ketosis and then back off slightly so that they are moderately in ketosis.  When in ketosis, you have no hunger and can then count overall calories while your body burns body fat to meet sugar needs.  It is not a medical emergency and should not be mistreated as such.  It is important to take vitamins and guard your health.  Dr. Atkins eventually ended up calling his diet "The Anti Aging Diet"  He was right.

After retirement from Pacific Bell Telephone, I needed to get steady exercise, so I chose a physical job.  (Some Retirement!) I work with 400 "kids" who are 19 to 25 years old for the most part.   This old man who is almost 60 is the arm wrestling champion of the work place. 

People tell me that I look to be in my forties. I believe I can thank Dr. Atkins for that.  I have my natural hair color and have all of my hair.  People remark about that every day.  I am convinced that my appearance is due to my diet. Even my doctor who is younger than I am looks to be far far older. There is a marked benefit to staying in light ketosis for about half of the past 35 years. My doc does not believe it. He was schooled by a medical school that taught him the importance of balanced diet.  Balanced diet does not work for people who convert any excess Carbs to body fat.  Ask Delta Burke or Oprah or ME.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 01 2006 at 11:32pm
Originally posted by Chloe Chloe wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong ketosis can lead to acidosis? Does the avian flu live in a an acidic blood chemistry? How dangerous is this to the kidneys?


Ketones when in the bloodstream can slightly change the pH of the blood.  It appears that the common usage of acidosis is to imply excessive pH change brought on by severe ketones.

The slight change in pH brought on by the Dr. Atkins diet should not cause any damage to the kidneys.  Again, it is not the same as when a person is diabetic and has serious fluctuations in blood sugar.

It is true that being in ketosis is great for ridding the body of retained water. It is better than any diuretic on the market in that regard.  That can be healthy if you have a large body mass and large amounts of retained water. A lot of overweight people have a tendency to swell up with water and are frequently prescribed diuretics by the pill pushers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Valkyrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2006 at 8:57am
I have done the Atkins program a lot for over 5 years now and those have been my healthiest  generally and especially as far as catching communicable  diseases such as colds or flu.Also have had many remark on the aging aspect that you mentioned.I also have read though that the eskimos were hit hard by the 1918 flu pandemic and they ate a total carbohydrate free diet in those times so I believe the evidence is contradictory at best.My own 2 cents worth is Im glad I found this much healthier way to eat...I feel great,blood pressure is better than most 16 year olds and my body functions as it should.It amazes me that most believe the truth that if you eat sugar or starch that it almost immediately quickly turns to fat...but believe that if you restrict carbos   you will be depleted and faint or something!The body just as quickly takes that fat and turns it right back into sugar if you need it in the absence of insulin.That  is why a diabetics blood sugar can rise overnight even if they have eaten nothing.It is the way our bodies were designed to run.Its too much sugar  or carbohydrates that stimulates too much insulin that makes us sick and fat.Insulin is the fat storage hormone and in its presence its impossible to use your body fat for fuel.Too much insulin makes your blood sugar hit rock bottom and THAtS why people feel faint and shaky and dive for more sugar and carbohydrates and the vicious circle renews itself..I would rather face bird flu healthy if I have to face itat all.
reading between the lines can be most informative....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2006 at 9:10am
I have done the Adkins diet and also have been very happy with the results.  My doctor did a cholestoral and trigliceride screening and I had very high lipid levels.  He wanted me to go on a lipid lowering agent and even gave me a prescription.  I had read that the Adkins diet could help control lipid levels so I tried that instead of the prescription.  On one of my follow up visits the doctor was very impressed with the results.  He said not only were my lipids in the normal range but that I actually had the lipids of a marathon runner.  He couldn't believe it.  Also, I did't get tired anymore in  the afternoons, no post carb crashes.  I just stay low carb and my lipids have been fine now for 3 years. 
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I too have been on the Adkins diet, sort of. I actually prescribe to the 'blood type' diet, which is almost the same thing. I eat a high protein low carb diet. My main thing is restricting wheat gluten, which is in most carbs that people eat. I used to have crohns, lupus, r. arthritis, gall bladder disease and high blood pressure. Whew! I've been illness free for four years, actually going on five now. A couple of years ago my father had a heart attack due to high blood pressure caused by clogged arteries. His doctor put him on an experimental treatment that essentially put him in ketosis. It was a synthetic protien run through IV for several hours a day. He now has great cholesterol, BP etc.  My experience is that ketosis is a very healthy condition to maintain.
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Ooops Joe I meant to answer your question. Yes, I did get the flu while in a state of moderate ketosis. Two years ago. Could be I had let too many carbs in right at that time, not sure. But my regular diet like I said has been high protien low carb for past four years. I wouldn't want to be a test subject on that, yikes. But I think maintaining this kind of a diet is a great idea for those concerned with good health, bf or no bf.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Valkyrie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2006 at 11:50am
Comment on the lowered lipids those on controlled carb diets enjoy...the liver turns sugar(carbohydrates)into lipids(fats...or triglycerides is the technical word for it).All you have to do is stop pumping large amounts of carbos to stop clogging your arteries.The drug companies who sell medications to lower blood fats dont want you to know that btw....
reading between the lines can be most informative....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HOPEFLOATS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2006 at 12:12pm
I was on that diet or way of life for 3 years. I was the healthiest I had ever been. Due to a few bad choices I have been off of the diet for 18 months now.  I feel horrible tired and I am constantly sick. I was never sick while on the diet. I have considered going back to it and after reading all of this I believe I will start again in the morning.
 
But I was not ill in the 3 years I was on this diet.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2006 at 12:20pm
Originally posted by HOPEFLOATS HOPEFLOATS wrote:

I was on that diet or way of life for 3 years. I was the healthiest I had ever been. Due to a few bad choices I have been off of the diet for 18 months now.  I feel horrible tired and I am constantly sick. I was never sick while on the diet. I have considered going back to it and after reading all of this I believe I will start again in the morning.
 
But I was not ill in the 3 years I was on this diet.


Get one of the Dr. Atkins books to keep you mentally positive about it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Frisky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2006 at 6:57pm
  My personal opinion is that the Adkins diet works. My opinion above was related to my experience with patients in general who have ketosis  when presenting with injury or illness. The long term positive consequences of weight control are unquestionable. I made the observation on this forum on a previous post that I only see 7 patients:  alcohol, cigarettes, drugs, irresponsible sex, obesity, stupidity, and bad luck. The usual patient I see with ketosis is secondary to diabetes ,alcohol, or starvation and with injury or illness, such as flu, mortality and morbidity go way up. The list of complications I have seen secondary to weight loss  programs is fairly long
 but none have been due to the Adkins diet, but I am biased. Next week I am going to my father's ranch to work cattle.   ER Doc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 02 2006 at 8:59pm
moo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HaMachiach Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: October 31 2015 at 9:18am
The ketogenic state is being examined to protect against malaria.

Malaria is caused by a parasite that inhabits red blood cells (erythrocytes).   http://www.malariaworld.org/blog/glucose-and-malaria - The infected cells  have an enormous requirement for glucose (emphasis mine):

Malaria parasites also are dependent on glucose as a nutrient source. As Plasmodium has no capacity to store energy in the form of glycogen they rely entirely on an exogenous supply of glucose. The infected erythrocyte exhibits a substantial increase in its permeability to low molecular weight sugar. The metabolism of the parasite utilizes up to 75 times more glucose than uninfected erythrocytes. Glucose is vital for PlasmodiumAn in vitro study (H Humeida et al., J of Diabetology, October 2011, 3:6) has shown that growth and proliferation is impaired below 5.5 mM.

Inflenza is a parasitic germ much like maleria and so it would make sense that it might protect against flu. 
Ultimatly ketone bodies and endocanabinoids are realy what keep you alive and well and both are products of dietary fats. Its Ebola we should be worying about becaus that is a virus that is mutating and will cause big problems in the not so distant future.I
From personal experience when in deep ketosis i dont get ill apart from once but i got over it in 3 days whereas the rest of my family (who are still carb (suggar) additcs took weeks to get over the same flu.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2017 at 5:44pm
So Yes you can get the flu while in ketosis. I am a college student who has been in ketosis for two weeks while sticking to the Medifast plan. I came down with Flu A two days ago and immediately started tamiflu. I have never had the flu before now, but from what I can see, my recovery has been faster than normal. It has been almost two days since my first symptoms, and my person feels pretty good. Not sure if the ketosis state helped or hindered this.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiMum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 02 2017 at 7:25pm
I might be wrong here, but I read recently that it takes a couple of weeks for the body to fully get into a carbohydrate restricted diet, so perhaps if you'd been on it for a month or longer, you wouldn't have caught the flu. Maybe you were still in a transitional stage. 
If it is to be, it is up to me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 03 2017 at 1:26pm
There are also degrees of ketosis.  Perhaps that makes a difference. 

The Atkins diet, for instance, is quite mild compared with medical ketosis diet used for control of epilepsy (see the website Matthews friends for details) which is sufficiently extreme to require constant monitoring and some medical intervention.
Absence of proof is not proof of absence.
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