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US on the brink of civil war |
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KiwiMum
Chief Moderator Joined: May 29 2013 Status: Offline Points: 29670 |
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Posted: August 28 2017 at 2:37pm |
This news story appeared in the New Zealand Press this morning. Enjoy.
That is the frightening prediction of the American right-wing activist, Roger Stone, one of US President Donald Trump's most outspoken supporters. Stone, himself, has many painful personal memories of the impeachment process. He was, after all, an official in the administration of President Richard Nixon. JOSHUA ROBERTS/REUTERS US President Donald Trump arrives at a campaign rally in Phoenix, Arizona, on August 22. But, a lot has changed in 40 years.
In 2017, Stone warns, impeaching a sitting Republican president might not be so easy: "Both sides are heavily armed ... This is not 1974. The people will not stand for impeachment." Asked if he was predicting civil war, Stone replied unequivocally: "Yes, that's what I think will happen." YURI GRIPAS/REUTERS Donald Trump still has considerable support among "a socially disaffected rump". Nonsense? Not according to the editorial writers of New Zealand's own Listener magazine: "Were Trump either to quit in pique and frustration or, worse, be removed by either of the legal means available, the US would risk being plunged into civic unrest on an unknowable scale." Drawing its readers' attention to the "considerable" support that Trump still commands among "a socially disaffected rump", the Listener argues that his diehard supporters "might not hesitate to form militias and try to instigate civil war". How has it come to this? How has the greatest republic the world has ever known been led to the edge of such a profound political abyss? A more useful line of questioning might begin with another, albeit related, question: How has the American republic avoided dissolution for so long? Because the most astonishing historical fact about the United States of America is that it is still with us. It very nearly wasn't. Had anyone but Abraham Lincoln won the 1860 presidential election, it is highly unlikely that the United States as we know it would have survived. Either, the American South's "peculiar institution" of slavery would have obliged its anti-slavery Northern neighbours to undertake a long and painful retreat from the "self-evident" truths of the American revolution. Or, the North American continent would have been divided between the "United", and the "Confederate", States of America. Ad Feedback < id="google_ads__/6674/onl.stuff.world/americas_5" title="3rd party ad " name="google_ads__/6674/onl.stuff.world/americas_5" width="300" height="250" scrolling="no" marginwidth="0" marginheight="0" border="0" style="padding: 0px; margin: 0px; border-width: 0px; border-style: initial; vertical-align: bottom;"> Lincoln forestalled both of these outcomes – but only at enormous cost. The casualties inflicted during the American Civil War of 1861-65 still outnumber all the casualties sustained by the USA in all subsequent conflicts – including World Wars I and II. What's more, the terrible political wounds opened up by the Civil War: essentially a conflict about the economic and social role of Race in American society; have never properly healed. Lincoln's successors brave attempt to vindicate the sacrifices of the Civil War: the so-called "Reconstruction Period"; lasted barely a decade. Equality between Southern blacks and whites could only be enforced by the bayonets of the occupying Union Army. Its withdrawal, in 1877, was followed by the brutal subjugation and virtual re-enslavement of the black population by the white. The means adopted: illegal terror by the Ku Klux Klan, reinforced by the institutional repression of "Jim Crow" segregation laws, received no early constitutional reproof from the Supreme Court. The federal government thereby signalled its willingness to see established, across the South, racist political regimes that can only be described as "proto-fascist". Accordingly, when critics of the Alt-Right demonstrators in Charlottesville denounce their "fascist" tactics as foreign to American democracy, they're mistaken. The much more unpalatable truth is that many of the political motifs we associate with European fascism were actually borrowed from America. Torchlight parades, for example, date all the way back to the 1832 campaign of America's first populist president, Andrew Jackson. Klansmen's robes may, similarly, have inspired Mussolini's black-shirts and Hitler's stormtroopers. And anyone who believes that the Nazi Party invented the mass political rally should take a look at any American party convention, or the news photographs of 50,000 robed Klansmen marching down Pennsylvania Ave in 1924. Racism, and the fascistic trappings that give it political momentum, are as American as apple-pie. Indeed, it is possible to argue that the Kennedy/Johnson-led Democratic Administrations' successful efforts to abolish Jim Crow and end Klan terror in the early-1960s have been the primary drivers of American politics ever since. Be it Nixon's 1968 "Southern Strategy"; Reagan's upholding of "State's Rights" in 1980; or, Trump's 2016 "Let's make America GREAT again!" (i.e. "WHITE" again) campaign slogan; the Republicans have been the party of race-based politics for nearly 50 years. That President Obama was followed by President Trump is no historical accident. Tragically, the Republican Party has made itself a willing hostage to the political terror and unconstitutional objectives that have always marched in lock-step with the advance of America's white supremacist traditions. Defeating both may well require a second civil war. |
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Those who got it wrong, for whatever reason, may feel defensive and retrench into a position that doesn’t accord with the facts.
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Medclinician
V.I.P. Member Valued Member Since 2006 Joined: July 08 2009 Status: Offline Points: 23322 |
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I agree with you. We are on the verge of a Civil war and anarchy in the streets. But while they play beat up the fat republican kids in Berkley - they will have immigrants with weapons flooding in the move from house to house shooting people and these will be memories of a fallen country.
Medclinician |
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"not if but when" the original Medclinician
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KiwiMum
Chief Moderator Joined: May 29 2013 Status: Offline Points: 29670 |
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Med, are you in America?
I've only ever changed planes there, but I get the impression that there are more guns per capita head there than anywhere else on earth, so at least when the civil war starts it'll all be over in a flash as everyone will shoot someone else and then get shot themselves.
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Those who got it wrong, for whatever reason, may feel defensive and retrench into a position that doesn’t accord with the facts.
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jacksdad
Executive Admin Joined: September 08 2007 Location: San Diego Status: Offline Points: 47251 |
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Sorry Med, but that's ridiculous. Your hatred for immigrants is beginning to seriously cloud your judgement, and your posts are becoming more and more alarmist with little to back them up but your imagination. Yes, we're in a period of great change and Trump is the cause of much of it, but to continually allude to widespread anarchy in the streets and immigrants running riot is bordering on delusional. There are protests - Trump's archaic pre-civil rights policies are quite rightly pissing off a lot of people - but it's not the way you portray it. Not by a long way. Anyone reading your posts from outside the US would have an image of a country in upheaval with rioting on every corner, and nothing could be further from the truth. Seriously - get a grip. I don't doubt that an impeachment would almost certainly be met with protests (and I'm sure violence) by his supporters, but a full blown civil war is not going to happen. |
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"Buy it cheap. Stack it deep"
"Any community that fails to prepare, with the expectation that the federal government will come to the rescue, will be tragically wrong." Michael Leavitt, HHS Secretary. |
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Technophobe
Assistant Admin Joined: January 16 2014 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 88450 |
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What he said!
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How do you tell if a politician is lying?
His lips or pen are moving. |
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arirish
Admin Group Joined: June 19 2013 Location: Arkansas Status: Offline Points: 39215 |
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What they said!!
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Buy more ammo!
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Satori
Valued Member Joined: June 03 2013 Status: Offline Points: 28655 |
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Jim Bakker and Charles M. Blow agree: Trump is pushing America toward a new neo-Christian Civil War
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2017/9/1/1695351/-Jim-Bakker-and-Charles-M-Blow-agree-Trump-is-pushing-America-toward-a-new-neo-Christian-Civil-War "
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“The point of modern propaganda isn’t only to misinform or push an agenda. It is to exhaust your critical thinking, to annihilate truth.” Gary Kasparov
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CRS, DrPH
Expert Level Adviser Joined: January 20 2014 Location: Arizona Status: Offline Points: 26660 |
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Full disclosure....I train with the FBI, these are the types of agents that the so-called "rebels" will face if they raise arms against the US Constitution. These are FBI SWAT team members...deadly shots, all of them. Don't believe this "civil war" hokum, the Far Right have tried a number of times = Ruby Ridge etc.
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CRS, DrPH
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EdwinSm,
Moderator Joined: April 03 2013 Status: Offline Points: 24065 |
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Is that the Jim Bakker who was imprisoned for accounting fraud?
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Technophobe
Assistant Admin Joined: January 16 2014 Location: Scotland Status: Offline Points: 88450 |
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As far as I can tell, yes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Bakker
I like to check anything I find on Wikipedia out for myself, as anyone can update it and some stupid nerds share a nasty sense of humor. But, I would not personally know the guy from Adam, so I am a bit out of my league on this one. Assuming this article has not been penned by an idiot, or got at, yes.
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How do you tell if a politician is lying?
His lips or pen are moving. |
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CRS, DrPH
Expert Level Adviser Joined: January 20 2014 Location: Arizona Status: Offline Points: 26660 |
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Watch this idiot Nazi (Richard Preston) fire at a counter-protester at Charlottesville!
LOL!! He has to chamber a round, doesn't appear to hit anyone, and now HE'S IN JAIL!! If this is what the "armed uprising" will be like when Trump is dragged out of office, I don't think it will take very long to eliminate the threat to the US Constitution. Be safe! |
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CRS, DrPH
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