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PANDEMIC ALERT LEVEL
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    Posted: May 11 2006 at 7:26pm
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How about a crude sign out by the street that says "NEED FOOD".
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 14 2006 at 12:12pm
I am worried there is no answer,
I was thinking of appearing to be eating wild plants and weeds dandelions weeds wild blueberries . If anyone knocked on the door I would tell them I was foraging for food in the parks at night , with a flashlight or candle or even lighted piece of wood.

Maybe even posting on my door a list of edible plants that can be found at the local park on my door with a request not to knock on my door.

I plan to save my canned food for when time get hard and to avoid food smells.

Someone posted first food in the fridge then food in the cupboards rice and beans that require cooking , then can and dehydrated food for when hydro is out and by then most people would be out of food for awhile and most looters would be dead or more dangerouse. Saving the can food for hard times would be important to remember , it also can be safely stored in walls and other hiding spots

It would take planning and disicipline. I look forward to any sugestions from others.

    
    
    

Edited by Deanna - May 14 2006 at 12:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 14 2006 at 3:29pm
Originally posted by Survivor Survivor wrote:

I'm trying to figure out for example: what if food trucks were brought in to my community to distribute food rations? Then, I would have to show up (with everyone else) or it would look suspicious? I don't know.   
 
Sam,
 
The last place I want to be is around those who didn't prep. Ever wonder what their sanitation IQ is?
 
Now if I've gone through my supplies, I figure by that time the non-preppers are in bed ill or the grave. Therefore I would probably be first in line with the other 4 local preppers and have little fear of infection at that point. Wink
Survival does have an 'I'!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oknut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 14 2006 at 3:46pm
2ifbyC - do you think there will be any food trucks in the US?

I have my doubts, but it would be a good thing. I'd rather see my non-prepping neighbors have free food than be starving and desperate.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 14 2006 at 4:09pm
Originally posted by oknut oknut wrote:

2ifbyC - do you think there will be any food trucks in the US? 
 
I kinda doubt it. There may be a few community efforts, but the food won't last long and replenishment will be very iffy. That's just my guess.
Survival does have an 'I'!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 14 2006 at 4:52pm
You are forgetting trains as a means of mass transport for food. If there were any food shortages I'm sure that food would be given priority for transport. One long train can carry a LOT of food and only requires a couple of train employees to run.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 14 2006 at 5:39pm
That why some of us believe that the gov. will commandeer the RRs. We discussed this in another thread.
 
The problem will be distribution to the population. Plus how long will the supplies last if 40% of workers stay at home and little production/farming?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 15 2006 at 4:51am
My gas cooker (kitchen) is close to the street.  The vents go out there. I shall stuff them with sheets or something. I've also got a couple of covers that slide shut to replace the permanently open vents which are there at present.  Also I got a breadmaker and a tabletop electic hotplate.  They would only work if the electricity was on, but they could be used in rooms which open onto the back and no one can smell the cooking.  Otherwise, like Survivor, "I'm too sick too weak to go out".  Beth
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 15 2006 at 5:12am
I wonder if we're overthinking the aroma issue unless one lives in an apartment complex or the middle of downtown. How many 'mutant zombies' do we expect to wonder within the  ODD (olfactory detection distance) zone?
 
Don't get me wrong. I do consider it a factor, but way, way down the priority checklist. If you have any other gaps in your plans I would deal with them first!
 
For those truely concerned with aromas, extend your vents/exhausts to above your roof line if possible. That would aid in dispersing the mouth watering molecules and make it more difficult to determine the source.
 
 
 
.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scotty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 15 2006 at 6:23am
It seems that there is a temptation here to play both ends against the middle. Either this thing will rip through the polulation like a forest fire or else it will smoulder on for months. It can't do both.

The clever money is betting on a clean deal, quick kill, live or die pandemic. In this scenario utilities and food supplies will be intermittently available in most places. People will not take mass evasive action because it will peak before they realise it has started.

The alternative is a slow and grinding infection that lasts for perhaps a year. In this scenario only the ultra cautious preppers will hunker down. The rest will simply acclimatise to the situation. Do remember that in London, at the very height of the black death, people worked on as usual. (Boiled Frog Syndrome)

Any attempt to predict the course of a pandemic using pick and mix theory is unlikely to be successful.

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I vaguely recall reading recently that in a pandemic any one community might be affected seriously for only a period of weeks during a wave before moving on to another community. Thus different communities across the country could be affected at different times during the same wave.
 
I wish I could remember where I read that as I don't remember now the number of weeks that one community might be affected. I'm fairly sure it was less than two months.
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Yes, It was a fairly short time.   The fact that we have a much larger more techno advanced life now may help us recover faster.  It's the poorer countries that face a long haul I imagine.  I wish Bill had bought Africa clean water systems, seed, irrigation and farm equip.

My question is... How long will we have to remain isolated?  Or will we know when it's ok.  They told people in 1918 or 19 that it was ok to take off the masks...then 5,000 more died in that city.  The doctors wanted parades stoped but the city fathers had them anyway.  We are wiser now.

But will the schools close in time?  In NYS the Gov. and others have the power to close schools over local government and school officials.  Is it like that in most state pandemic plans?
 
And have they decided who exactly is in charge during a pandemic?
 
The Pesident is speaking ronight on illegal immigration, do you think he will say anything about preparing for possible pandemic?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scotty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 15 2006 at 10:25am
How long? The more you know about this potential pandemic the greater your problem becomes. The more cautious you are the greater your problem becomes. The optimists have it easy whilst the cautious and determined survivors may be bottled up for twelve months. Most of the population will have little choice but to emerge from their homes within days but they may live, or perhaps not live, to regret it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DAX COM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 15 2006 at 11:07am
We're in serious trouble when this hits.  If the Pandemic performs along the same lines as all previous pandemics, there will be several waves, the first deadly, the second catastrophic, and a third mutation of the initial virus will be slightly less deadly as the third wave passes.  The 1918 Influenza behaved exactly like that, was an H (avian virus) and it took better than a year to burnout to an extent that it wasn't noticable as a pandemic influenza.
Given the historical example and model that pandemic influenzas follow I would not think this one was going to be "over with" in a few months, or even half a year.
Certainly it is a good thing that we all keep to, or start, thinking "outside the box" regarding all the likely scenarios and situations that might arise.  This thread is yet another topic that many have thought about, whether publically or just in private, and it's important that people give such things some consideration to before events wash over us.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 15 2006 at 12:53pm
Dax Com Your outside the box suggestion was on target,
survival will depend on using different skills and lots of planning for different situations.

Food smells are way more important than people realize , isnt there one house on your street where the food aroma is always wonderful . My neighbour often barbeque or do stews that I can smell half a block away.

Appearing unprepared may saveyour life , There must be hundreds of ideas. So many people have lived in dangerous situations where they had to hide there wealth food.
I look forward to your responsess as I truly enjoy creatiity and outside the box thinking

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ravendawn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 15 2006 at 3:38pm

Sometime ago i found a site explaining how to hide food and smoke smells by running a pipe from your house to a compost heap using the compost as a filter,i have no idea if this would work and i cannot find the site i found the info on ,any ideas if this extraction without the use of electric fans would be possible.

 

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If you appear unkempt and wear baggy clothes, you'll fit in. Smelling a bit may help. Be seen foraging in the yard or area while looking at an edible plant guide. Be visibly armed. As a rule, food can be smelled as far away as smoke. Stick to something like rice in a pressure cooker as there is little aroma to begin with and the time it is produced is limited.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 16 2006 at 8:06am
Originally posted by Survivor Survivor wrote:

appearing deranged or drunk frightens people  
 
Deranged would work.
 
Drunks appear vulnerable.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son Of Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2006 at 4:30pm
Hi

I must say some things in this forum make me smile and laugh, this is good fo the soul, especially since we are all worried and are speaking concerning vital survival matters, i dont know about the smell and food problems, i havent come so far in my prep yet since i dont live together with my daughter and ex, hence my problem is to adjust my life to save theirs...

well anyway i have thougt to arm myself, with a gasgun just to scare people if they try to rob me of my respirators, you know we dont carry real guns and firearms in Norway :) having a respirator outside during teh pandmeic will make alot of people envious, in Japan and Asia they are used to it, but then again we must waitt and see how common it will become to walk outside for any reason, if survival becomes fashion then we will all lead the way. but if survival becomes a matter of regret for most, then i to believe human basic instincs will play a role in the new jungle of modern pandemics,

in this case i must say i am sorry for the fact of violence being so widespread allrady now in the USA, i can understand you fears, i live in Norway with 4 million citizens, if a murder happens in this country its headlines in all papers, so you can understand that the smell of food in a worst case scenario here will make others hungry and make them rob stores etc although i am not underestimating the potential evil in us all which i do think exists.

What did strike me is that many of you could consider "imigrating" to Skandinavia, why not?

Even if just for some years, remember that there are no places in teh world with the same social benefits as in these countries, if you are workless and homeles they provide for you, healthinsurance? there is no such thing here, all is given freely, well you do pay taxes but then again you do get alot back, i know it sounds strange but consider the past, countless imigrants went to America from these countries, why not take the same path back:)?

If you feel it would be a hard time to move to a new country alone, why not create an entire new community of survivalist? if not in skandinavia then consider Iceland an island which probably will be hit by BF among the last of all, with all the knowledge found among you, a new world could be build upon your shoulders through this kind of community!

In any way, i do honestly whish you all the best of luck.

www.birdfluera.com
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 17 2006 at 5:46pm
First of all, welcome to the site! I look forward to your points of view and the preps you and your countrymen are considering.
 
Originally posted by Son Of Man Son Of Man wrote:

Even if just for some years, remember that there are no places in teh world with the same social benefits as in these countries, if you are workless and homeles they provide for you, healthinsurance? there is no such thing here, all is given freely, well you do pay taxes but then again you do get alot back,
 
Those are the exact reasons I would not move to a socialistic country. Wealth redistribution and rewarding the 'capable unproductive' are not my cup of tea.
 
I'm not slamming you , just letting you know that many of us do not find that environment attractive. There are many here in the US that would be quite happy in your system and I wish there was a way to get them there!
 
i know it sounds strange but consider the past, countless imigrants went to America from these countries, why not take the same path back:)?
 
Can you guess why we haven't? Must be some reason that you do not have Americans returning to their Scandinavian heritage en mass...
 
What will happen to your population if the BF hits your country hard? Will the government be there for you? Or will you have to survive on your own? If the latter, will you know what to do and be prepared?
 
I hope I do not sound too harsh, but hopefully you'll find that on this site  we hold the individual and family in the highest regards, as opposed to Father/Mother Government.
 
I also hope that you and yours fare well and never have to endure the faces the of desperate people.
 
BTW, I thought that in Norway you can have fully automatic weapons with silencers encouraged. Maybe it's Sweden I'm thinking of...
 
 
 
.
 
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son Of Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 2:40am
Hi 2ifbyc, thanks for you reply.

I must reply on some of your views, wealth distrubution or even communist approach will probably the only way that some nations will get through a pandemic, yes most will have to fend for themselves and care for the sick at home, it is not only scandinavians who will be without help from their states, most nations will not have teh ability to care for their own.

Let me tell you a sad fact, the norwegian Government have given 50 million norwegian krones to the bird Flu preparedness for teh country, this ammount can be compared to teh 1500 billion krones which are saved due to their oil revenues, see the picture? i have contact with some Norwegian scientists who agree that the state and healthauthorities are disinformed about the real threat of the virus, hence i myself feel sad and angry that people like me who hands out flyers with information are doing the job of the state.

when it comes to dealing with capable unproductivem, well let me tell you, i dont work now, i havent for 8 months, i did work for 7 years since i came from Sweden to Norway, but now it is my right to recieve money while unemployed, hence i will not complain because when showdown happens, do you think i will want to be a slave unto society?

No i would not ever choose other countries above these, then again i am a Swedish citizen, although i came from Romania when i was 9 years old with my family, Romania which now has bird flu in more than 60 cities, do you think they will cope better than these nations up north? never.

Sadly i do not hold this fact to my own good, ignorance is widesprad across the whole world, if not from being blinded by money, then because the number of populations in various countries outnumber many other, making it a much more difficult task for some nations to allocate their resources in time of need, i think you know what i mean when you consider Katriana.

There are ways to get u here:) americans do actually come here alot and many move here from other countries when they realize all the benefits like the good jobmarket or maternity leave, or vacation periods much longer than the states, remember that the UN for the fifth year in a row voted Norway to be trhe best country in the world to live in!

I know that the governemnet wont be here for me, i try to aid myself, and you know it seems i am among very few doing so, i have tried to teach myself the best i can, hence my site www.birdfluera.com
, but it dose not mean that i will survive, which is a sad fact because i have a daughter living with her mother, who will care for them, most people here are way to much ignorant than i feel i myself am, and what good does it do my case that the media is unaware of the danger? well it only makes my struggle worse.

No one is encouraged to have weapons in norway, hunters are allowed with permits, handheld guns are rare, ofcourse there are criminals here to, but rotten egg exist among all nations.

Ok hope all is well with you to, and good luck

Pater
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 6:10am
Son of Man,
 
Thank you for your 'gentle' response!
 
It sounds as though you have a  proper perspective regarding your well being if the BF reaches your area. I commend you for your efforts in spreading the BF news.
 
Hopefully our governments will 'wake up' and reprioritize once the BF goes H2H. They certainly are asleep at the wheel at this point.
 
Take care and be prepared!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son Of Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 7:31am
    Thanks :)

You know when it comes to the rulers of nations, i can hardly trust them, we are all humans living in error, i spoke today with the Norwegian scientist i mentioned before, i noticed in his words that he had become more pesimistic concerning the outlook for the world since i last spoke with him, i asked him if this was so, he said yes, computer models an simulations have recently shown that the bird flu can spread and infect more than 95 % of all humanity!

he said if the pandmeic starts now, it is to late for nations to act or to even try to put in place any kind of preventions, he said and this took a grip on my heart " we can only wait to die "

i was sad, the few other times i have spoken with him before he was more optimistic than myself, a few days back there was a debate on tv with him and other foreign scientists on, sadly those invited who are in the Norwegian commitee to plan for a pandemic are not worried and minimize the the threat over and over.

I am really sad, not only because of one nations disability to act out of ignorance, but i am sad for all those scientists around the world that actually worry night and day for all the rest of us and they have been doig so for many years, like this man said to me, although i to know that Norway i second on Solvays vaccine list a firm which my own father has worked for.

He said what good does that do us, if those who must produce the vaccine die?

very true, the facts are becoming more and more dark, as for myself i can promisse you this: if ever God forbid, my daughter should pass because of a nations ignorance because they do not respect a primitive entity like the H5N1, you will see me on every interanational news, for i will no longer hold back my fury and anger, politics i will tread under my feet and make my faith a salvation to those in need when i will turn this world up side down!

ps sorry for not keeping my posts aligned after the topic, I am sorry for all of this.

Bless your path

Pater
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote figmentt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 10:10am
 I like the idea of having a list of edible plants. I'm going to
print  up a list and make copies . I'll spead them around when
things get tough so it looks like that's how I'm surviving.
 
  I guess I should also print up how to skin and prepare
rabbit and  squirrl. any suggestions on  these.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oknut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 11:02am
Years ago when we still lived in Wisconsin, a friend of ours used to cook up big batches of rabbit and it was very good. I've never done it.

She'd cook it up in a nesco and used a lot of garlic, some wine and it was in a sort of BBQ sauce.

Really did taste a lot like chicken.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MelodyAtHome Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 12:09pm
Is there a breadmaker machine that doesn't need electricity?  I'm guessing just my 2 handsWink So What I have is a fireplace. I do have propane but if that runs out how do I cook my bread or bisquick biscuits. Anyone know? I know in Spain where my dad's family is from still has a community oven made out of brick and of course heat with wood. Wonder if we need to make a little one like that. My family there still live like they did hundreds of years ago. Very interesting to see and a lot learned too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MelodyAtHome Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 12:14pm
I was also wondering about eating the wild animals. How do we know they have not been infected? Like deer and rabbit. I would not want to try the ducks, geese, turckey...what do you all think?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ravendawn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 12:24pm
I think you have to be careful with rabbit as it takes minerals out of the body whilst digesting it and could prove counter productive as a food source.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MelodyAtHome Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 12:28pm
What about snakes? I've seen the survivorman on TV eat them. we are in Ohio so don't think any would be poisonous. I think I could try snake if there is any nutrition. We have pond fish but not sure about that. Also a river near by where people fish all the time but afraid it could get polluted at a time of chaos.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 18 2006 at 1:46pm
I think the idea is too give the impression that we are surviving on wild plants rather than actually doing it.

I plan to tell anyone who asks that I am living on wild plants and small animals, I will post the signs on my door and give a list of plants that are edible and say do not knock.
But quiety eating canned food no smells heating it with even the heat of a candle in a old fundue pot. or if times get really rough cold

Someone suggested a hidden casche of canned foods cash and meds . I totally agree ,
    
    
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