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PANDEMIC ALERT LEVEL
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Tracking the next pandemic: Avian Flu Talk

Leavitt says pandemic will last 12 to 18 months

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 6:13am
It is encouraging that the government in the U.S. is becoming more responsive to the conerns of the public as well as being realistic in addressing the high probability of the pandemic, while we can most efficiently prepare for it; while our communications, transportation, and work force is still intact.

Despite some comments, I honestly think we are dealing with a new generation of government which are taking a realistic hard look at problems and coming up with improving plans of action to combat the Avian disease.

One point, which I have stated, and is restated by many governmental and health leaders - whether Avian or another type of virus, or even several, we will be faced in the near future with a Pandemic. I believe it will hit third world countries much harder and we may find ourselves in a situation where we are called upon to help other countries. The image of America as a helper and partner in World Health will go a long way towards healing old wounds and establishing new friendships and stronger alliances, as well as a more positive image of America.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bargie34 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 6:49am
A lot of foods taste better with a bit of bacon.

Is it possible to pre-cook bacon and vacuum pack it? How long will it last?
I sometimes buy it in the grocery store, already cooked and vacuum packed, but it is so expensive.

I have purchased huge packages of rice, pasta and flour. Are you recommending that these products be put into smaller storage bags and frozen?

I would very much appreciate your advice. Forgive me if these issues have already been addressed.

With love and best wishes to all,

bargie34
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote endman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 7:13am
The current administration is in Fault for this disaster, and Bush is the administration.
In this country you can’t buy a car or a house without insurance.
I want to see BF insurance for this country that covers everybody not just selected few.
I some people will have access to this vaccine or drug they will be more equal that the other people.
Example: If Administrations needs more solders just promise to vaccinate them and you will have an army of millions---No body what’s to die   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raven Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 7:16am
Originally posted by bargie34 bargie34 wrote:

A lot of foods taste better with a bit of bacon.
  SmileSmileSmile I agree.

For years I have been draining off bacon fat (when I cook bacon) into a glass jar, that sits on the counter top.  The fat gets used from time to time but it also seems to keep for ages (at room temperature etc).  At least in the eight or so years I have done this I have had not trouble with it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote July Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 7:18am
[QUOTE=Jhetta]Are you happy with honeyville grains... I just found them.
 
Yes we have been using them for a while now.
I orginaly purchased from them for convience of having powdered eggs to cook with when out of fresh. We use the dried fruits on a regular basis for snacks etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Legacy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 8:52am
Hi Bergie...welcome! I've been reading this forum several months and most agree that any and all grains should be frozen for at least 3 days before storing, in order to kill off any bugs or eggs that might remain. I think you only need to re-bag them if they-re not already in bags...like boxed rice, for example. Many have suggested regular heavy-duty zip-lock bags or, even better, the vacuum storage bags. I was concerned about water condensation inside the bags during the freezing process, but that was not a problem. Happy freezing!
I do everything my Rice Crispies tell me to....
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Originally posted by NZ er NZ er wrote:

Wondering where the notion/idea comes from, regarding time frame..duration of possible future pandemic. I am interested to know. Why do some people think this could be for so long..how long was the one in 1918, anyone have ideas where this comes from? Many of us that are prepping wont last for THAT long!!  Cry 
 
The 1918 pandemic lasted 2 years. It had 3 or 4 waves. I think they are just going from history
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The preps are to help you through the most difficult times when services have broken down.  Breakdowns in service will usually be corrected within a few days to weeks.  Regardless of the Bird Flu threat I have always had a lot of canned food available "just in case."  We just rotate the stocks, so no canned items sit for too long in our house.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ROSEBGOOD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 9:33am
Don't worry.  You prep for 6 weeks at a time.  Once the first wave passes you prepare again and so on. 
 
By what I have read, we are not going to be exposed the whole time.  If it passes in waves....doesn't that give us time to regroup?
 
Please let me know.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Seajane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 9:35am
I used to buy canned bacon for camping trips...but havn't been able to find it now.  Will check the Army surplus stores for canned meats just in case.
Does anyone know where to find it?  I agree, bacon is great with fried rice, beans, eggs,  chowders and doesn't require much to get some flavor. I don't plan on freezing a hugh amount of meat as Im not counting on having power all the time, esp. in the winter.  Try getting someone to come out and work on our power lines during a pandemic.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VtDoc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 9:46am
endman: The current administration is in Fault for this disaster
 
As far as I can tell, there is currently no (infectious disease) disaster here, and there may not be one for years to come.  The fact is that the federal government is preparing in advance for this potential problem.  They are also telling state and local governments and businesses and individuals to prepare. 
 
some people will have access to this vaccine or drug...
 
There will obviously be a delay in creating a vaccine, in testing it, and finally in producing enough to cover everyone.  Of course, this means there will need to be a prioritization of who should get it first.  It remains to be seen exactly how it will distributed. 
 
 
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Originally posted by argyll argyll wrote:

I would like to purchase dehydrated eggs, does anyone know where they are available? Do any grocery stores/health food stores carry them?

Many Thanks!
 
Check out www.beprepared.com. they carry whole eggs, egg whites, scrambled eggs, eggs with bacon. It took a while to get mine, back-ordered, but did get them eventually.
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Bargie34, consider what could happen to all those big bags of rice, flour etc. during a pandemic. Once you open them, they are liable to spill, bug infestation etc. I would recommend that you take a look at
www.hillbillyhousewife.com . Tons of great, inexpensive and tasty recipes, all come with nutrient info and instructions. I learned there to pre-package complete meals including milk, spices etc. It was a total shock to see just how fast I was going thru a lot of items. I continue to package meals, rice-mixes, coffee's and teas. If a meal needs canned vegetables or beans or meat, it get put together in a paper-bag. Ready to go! It will make it a lot easier to be REALLY prepared and save a ton of water for clean-up! Besides, I tend to be repetious with meals, so now I can actually prepare for a greater variety while I have access to the net and all of you.
 
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I don't get their math. They tell us how deadly it is, 50% or more, then only a few hundred thousand will die. I guess their trying not to panic people but they need to get real.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gimme Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 10:45am
Originally posted by ImmuneConcerned ImmuneConcerned wrote:

A physician once recommended Ezekiel bread.  I've read one can last for a year just eating it.  I found a receipi on the net for it & it looks like all that is needed is hard red wheat (or substitutions of millet, garbanzo beans &/or lentils), spelt, barley, millet, lentils, great northern beans, red kidney beans & pinto beans, water, oil, yeast, honey or molasses & salt.  You can also purchase ezekiel-mix to ground into flour & buy the bread already made-- & frozen--many places.  I love it, my kids don't & can't have some of the ingredients.  So though it isn't high on our list, I'd recommend it to anyone interested.
 
~~~
 
Yum that sounds like a good receipe. Is ezekiel bread kinda like Pita bread?
 
 
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Originally posted by Femvet Femvet wrote:

Originally posted by argyll argyll wrote:


<FONT>I would like to purchase dehydrated eggs, does anyone know where they are available? Do any grocery stores/health food stores carry them?



Many Thanks!

 

Check out www.beprepared.com. they carry whole eggs, egg whites, scrambled eggs, eggs with bacon. It took a while to get mine, back-ordered, but did get them eventually.


Walton's has dried eggs. http://waltonfeed.com/
    
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Originally posted by Femvet Femvet wrote:

Bargie34, consider what could happen to all those big bags of rice, flour etc. during a pandemic. Once you open them, they are liable to spill, bug infestation etc. I would recommend that you take a look at
www.hillbillyhousewife.com . Tons of great, inexpensive and tasty recipes, all come with nutrient info and instructions. I learned there to pre-package complete meals including milk, spices etc. It was a total shock to see just how fast I was going thru a lot of items. I continue to package meals, rice-mixes, coffee's and teas. If a meal needs canned vegetables or beans or meat, it get put together in a paper-bag. Ready to go! It will make it a lot easier to be REALLY prepared and save a ton of water for clean-up! Besides, I tend to be repetious with meals, so now I can actually prepare for a greater variety while I have access to the net and all of you.

 

    
I've heard that if you put bay leaves in dried grain packages, the bugs will stay away. Best to freeze the grain 3 days first, though, in case bugs are in grain already.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Glow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 11:20am
Why in the world would they advise to prep for 2 weeks when this "could" last between 12-18 months.  I know perhaps they don't want to "panic" nor create a "mad rush" , but hey the mad rush will come eventually.....I hate it when they are so sly!!!!!!!
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Originally posted by Seajane Seajane wrote:

I used to buy canned bacon for camping trips...but havn't been able to find it now.  Will check the Army surplus stores for canned meats just in case.
Does anyone know where to find it?  I agree, bacon is great with fried rice, beans, eggs,  chowders and doesn't require much to get some flavor. I don't plan on freezing a hugh amount of meat as Im not counting on having power all the time, esp. in the winter.  Try getting someone to come out and work on our power lines during a pandemic.
 
You can buy it in pouches, jars with the salad dressing, croutons, etc at the stores I have found it
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dehydrated eggs from walton feeds
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Dried eggs and other dairy are very expensive.

Purchase a dehydrater and use it to dry your own,  much less expensive
and you can dehydrate just about anything.

Good reading:
http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=000oQX

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote winemaker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 3:38pm
I guess I underestimated the amount of ammunition I'll need.  Time to order another few thousand rounds!
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Walton Feeds is slllllllooooooooooowwwwwwwww as Molasses!  I would take my bidness elsewhere.  Try USA Emegency or Honeyville.

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As for food, after my 6-8 month supply of canned/bottled/boxed food runs out, I bought a book and some supplies for trapping and a rifle/ammo, extra veg. seeds, and a lot of flour, yeast and peanut butter and jelly. If you think about it, if you have planned for 6-8 months, you can probably stretch your supplies out to last much longer with a few additional preps. Just my thoughts on the topic.[/QUOTE]
 
Remember to get a good quantity of baling soda, it keeps well and it is good for a plethoria of uses, including leavening for bread, biscuits, etc.. Jo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Glenn 50 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 5:25pm
Thanks Diode...
Will try the egg drying. Thats after I finish drying the onions. Then the carrots. I have a heap of canned food so now the dryer can help out.
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for those with limited space, think about energy bars, that are full meal replacements. Think about cans of deydrated carnation instant breakfast.  Jars of Tang. get a plastic wadder pool, they come in a box, you only need a six inch by one and a half foot space to store them, they would store easily under a coach, and set them up in the living room of your apt. if you have to and fill with pitchers while you still have water. Buy a bottle of clorox for keeping the water clean, cover the pool with a shower curtain. Think about all you can do. If you have three family members, times three meals a day, you need nine bars for one day, 270 bars for a month, but that amount could be stored in a container under a bed. I would get the grain bars and not choclate stuff.  put the boxes in ziplock bags and then inside a plastic container that is made to go under your bed.
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Hello all. Newbie here. I'm going to the LDS (Mormon) Bishop Store House tomorrow to can my dry foods. They are going to charge me $0.77 to can my flour, sugar & rice. That is per #10 can. That includes the lid, the can, and the oxy-something?? I guess you can also buy dried fruit and other things there inexpensively. They sell powdered eggs inexpensively too. I looked into buying the canning stuff myself and it was much more expensive...plus I wouldn't know if I had done it right!
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Originally posted by bellabecky bellabecky wrote:

Hello all. Newbie here. I'm going to the LDS (Mormon) Bishop Store House tomorrow to can my dry foods. They are going to charge me $0.77 to can my flour, sugar & rice. That is per #10 can. That includes the lid, the can, and the oxy-something?? I guess you can also buy dried fruit and other things there inexpensively. They sell powdered eggs inexpensively too. I looked into buying the canning stuff myself and it was much more expensive...plus I wouldn't know if I had done it right!
 
Are you a member of the church.. and can anyone do this?
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I am not a member of the Church. Have never even been to a Mormon service. Anyone can do it. My daughter did date a Mormon boy (he went on his two year mission) and she went to a Mormon store and bought a t-shirt that says "he thinks I'm waiting"...LDS humor I guess?? That was back in January, but I called the store and they gave me the info. I'd heard the LDS offered the service to anyone. The store was called Deseret. They have a website where you can get the number for one in your community.
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It is part of their service/mission to have at least 12 months of supplies at all times, just in case. So they offer all the services for anyone to do it inexpensively. On the website they have a neat program where you type in how many people you have and how long you want to stock for and it tallys what and how much stuff you need. I started with one month, then went to three and keep going like that.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote winemaker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 6:22pm
Originally posted by endman endman wrote:

The current administration is in Fault for this disaster, and Bush is the administration.
In this country you can’t buy a car or a house without insurance.
I want to see BF insurance for this country that covers everybody not just selected few.
I some people will have access to this vaccine or drug they will be more equal that the other people.
Example: If Administrations needs more solders just promise to vaccinate them and you will have an army of millions---No body what’s to die   


Which disaster are you talking about?  I certainly would not call BF a disaster.  Maybe one day it will be, but not today.   And even if it becomes a disaster (lots of people dying), how is that Bush's fault?  Will he have contracted the disease intentionally and then coughed in your face to pass it to you? 

Maybe Bush should start writing insurance policies for the idiots who rely on government for everything. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AuntBones Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 07 2006 at 6:24pm
TrishaA yeast is in the air.Many years ago women would "trap" wild yeast to make bread.This was called starter. The problem is that you dont know what type of wild yeast you have( if not mistaken about 100 diffrent wild yeast in the world) till you make your bread.If you didnt trap the right type,bread will not rise well and will not have a good taste.Buy the store yeast it will save you time and money.Also go to Hillbilly Housewife web site.Her bread is easy to make.
    
    
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Don't forget baking soda can be used for making bread if you run out of yeast. Remember the irish soda breads. Baking soda can be used for many, many different things, heartburn, cleaning, etc..
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Originally posted by NZ er NZ er wrote:

Wondering where the notion/idea comes from, regarding time frame..duration of possible future pandemic. I am interested to know. Why do some people think this could be for so long..how long was the one in 1918, anyone have ideas where this comes from? Many of us that are prepping wont last for THAT long!!  Cry 
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Dont forget that Spam can be added to rice. Now you can get chicken or turkey spam. Its tasty and has a long shelf life.
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Originally posted by BoJingles BoJingles wrote:

Dont forget that Spam can be added to rice. Now you can get chicken or turkey spam. Its tasty and has a long shelf life.
 
My Dad loves Spam
 
  I have not eaten Spam since I was a little child.... I really did not like it... something about the gel on the top of the can really got to me.
 
I am thinking now that in dire circumstances the food I buy for my dog would probably be more nutritious. Chock full of omega 3, 6, 9, spinach, Q10, lycopene, lutin, acidophilus etc. 
 
 
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Originally posted by andrew p andrew p wrote:

Does he really describe the problem of choosing who gets the vaccine first a "delicious conundrum"? Since when is deciding who gets a better chance at life or death "delicious"?

The only delicious thing during a pandemic will be those big ol' piles of food in our basements...
 
I agree that this was a most inappropriate context in which to use that term.  Apparently, delicious conundrum is often used to describe a social dilemma.  I assume that it has a basis in literature, and people who are familiar with it like the sound of it so much that they use it at any opportunity.  However, it boggles the mind that Leavitt would use this term in such an incredibly inappropriate context. 
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Cumulative Number of Confirmed Human Cases of Avian Influenza A/(H5N1) Reported to WHO

6 June 2006

Country 2003 2004 2005 2006 Total

cases deaths cases deaths cases deaths cases deaths cases deaths

Azerbaijan 0 0 0 0 0 0 8 5 8 5

Cambodia 0 0 0 0 4 4 2 2 6 6

China 0 0 0 0 8 5 10 7 18 12

Djibouti 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 1 0

Egypt 0 0 0 0 0 0 14 6 14 6

Indonesia 0 0 0 0 17 11 32 26 49 37

Iraq 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 2 2 2

Thailand 0 0 17 12 5 2 0 0 22 14

Turkey 0 0 0 0 0 0 12 4 12 4

Viet Nam 3 3 29 20 61 19 0 0 93 42

Total 3 3 46 32 95 41 81 52 225 128

Total number of cases includes number of deaths.

WHO reports only laboratory-confirmed cases.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NZ er Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2006 at 12:40am
Table showing the huge jump in cases in Indonesia for year 2006.. and we are but half way through the year...Vietnam..0 ? We are constantly told it is not changing, but it must be in some way . .. anyone can see the increased incidence of infection and human deaths...why then is it infecting more people if nothing has changed? What is the answer to this? Either the population on the whole has become less able to fend off the virus which has been around for a time..or the virus has become stronger. 
 
I may live in NZ but you cant pull the wool over my eyes Wink
Land of the Long White Cloud
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2006 at 5:14am
Rice is a bit under 4 cals per gram (dry).  A woman needs 2000 cals per day approx.  500g rice x 4 cals= 2000 cals.  A man needs about 2500cals, or  625 grams.  Obviously it depends on build/actiivity levels etc etc.  I only need 1600-1800 cals as I am a small woman and do sedentary work.  Just adjust it for your family.  Beans are about 3.5 cals per gram dry, though it varies according to the type.
If you want dried eggs in the UK Tesco sells them in fairly small tubs on the baking section.  Honeygrain won't deliver to the UK.
Beth
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hitech_47460 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2006 at 7:13am
It is a great error to say "Bush learned from Katrina" when it was Mikey Chertoff of the Homeland GESTAPO who deliberately ordered supplies STOPPED from reaching victims there.  The whole purpose of the BOGUS Dec. 7 'Intelligence Reform Act' was to put ALL FEDeral agencies under the CONTROL of these FASCIST GOONS!  This IS Bush's fault for he's following a long term plan to bring in MARTIAL LAW!  The bird-brained flu is resurrected Spanish flu, (and it's already been ADMITTED this has been done)  This is one more contrived crisis to further remove our liberties as was the PHONY STAGED 911 'terror' even.  These people are GUILTY OF HIGH TREASON and deserving of the punishment that crime calls for!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2006 at 7:29am
Why would this be a Bush legacy?  He is not to blame for H5N1 nor any mutation of the virus!  At least he has learned from Hurricane Katrina by having Leavitt going around to each of the states and telling everyone ahead of time to not count on the Feds for assistance and to start individual, community, and state planning.
 
Am not blaming him for anything. Just as we endured 9/11 as a nation this may be another significant historical event that occurs on his watch. Yes they learned from Katrina and that is why they are saying every state is on its own. Am not sure a lot of states have the money to deal with something of this magnitude.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2006 at 7:29am
Hi cap 1. I would suggest you read the book The Great Influenza by Barry. It's a facinating book, a little difficult to read at times, but it will help in understanding the avian flu and what could happen.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hitech_47460 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2006 at 8:29am
Here's how this FASCISM is rapidly progressing!
 
Research also the "Model Health Emergency Act" various states have been trying to shove through.
 

Informed Consent Waived in Public Crisis

WASHINGTON (AP) - In a public health emergency, suspected victims would no longer have to give permission before experimental tests could be run to determine why they're sick, under a federal rule published Wednesday. Privacy experts called the exception unnecessary, ripe for abuse and an override of state informed-consent laws.
By ANDREW BRIDGES, Associated Press Writer

Last update: June 07, 2006 – 8:27 PM

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WASHINGTON (AP) - In a public health emergency, suspected victims would no longer have to give permission before experimental tests could be run to determine why they're sick, under a federal rule published Wednesday. Privacy experts called the exception unnecessary, ripe for abuse and an override of state informed-consent laws.

Health care workers will be free to run experimental tests on blood and other samples taken from people who have fallen sick as a result of a bioterrorist attack, bird flu outbreak, detonation of a dirty bomb or any other life-threatening public health emergency, according to the rule issued by the Food and Drug Administration.

In all other cases, the use of an experimental test still requires the informed consent of a patient, as well as the review and approval of an outside panel.

"To be candid, I hope it is a hypothetical problem. I hope we spent a lot of time creating a rule we never have to invoke,'' said Dr. Steve Gutman, director of the FDA's in-vitro diagnostics office.

Determining what constitutes a life-threatening public health emergency would be left up to the laboratories doing the testing. That creates the potential for conflicts of interest and other abuses, critics said.

"I don't like a rule like this because its most likely use is likely to be a form of abuse. The emergency exception it creates will be stretched to encompass non-emergency situations,'' said Jim Harper, director of information policy studies at the Cato Institute.

The FDA said it published the rule to ensure the ability to identify quickly whatever chemical, biological, radiological or nuclear agent is involved in a terrorist attack or natural outbreak of disease. Doing so could save the lives of those being tested as well as of others exposed, the FDA said.

"Baloney,'' said Dr. Deborah Peel, chairwoman of the Patient Privacy Rights Foundation, a watchdog group. "This sounds like they're taking for themselves the right to test individuals every time they declare a public health emergency. There is no way getting consent would delay testing.''

The FDA said that obtaining informed consent in those cases would be impracticable or unfeasible.

The rule lays out a scenario where a laboratory discovers what appears to be an unusual bug in a sample taken from a patient before a public health emergency was even suspected. With the apparent bug in the lab but the patient gone, going back for permission to use a confirmatory but experimental test - often the only type of test available - would introduce "unacceptable delays,'' the FDA said.

"They're basically overriding state informed-consent laws,'' said Sue Blevins, president of the Institute for Health Freedom. Blevins said her group advocates for informed consent but that in emergencies it could be sought after the fact.

"If they don't have the time to get it, at least inform them retroactively what's been done, so people can keep track of what information has been collected from them,'' Blevins said.

The rule took effect Wednesday but remains subject to public comment until Aug. 7. The FDA said it published the rule without first seeking comments because it would hinder the response to an outbreak of bird flu or other public health emergency.

"Nobody said two airplanes would fly into the World Trade Center, did they? We wouldn't have written the rule unless we thought it was a possibility,'' Gutman said.

The FDA said the lack of such an exemption impeded the public health response to the Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome, or SARS, epidemic of 2003.


On the Net:

Food and Drug Administration rule: http://www.fda.gov/OHRMS/DOCKETS/98fr/E6-8790.htm

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 08 2006 at 10:05am
Originally posted by winemaker winemaker wrote:

I guess I underestimated the amount of ammunition I'll need.  Time to order another few thousand rounds!
 
winemaker, I need a good source for ammo. Anybody you would feel comfortable recommending? TIA
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