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My fear when Mr. Trump takes the Oath of Office...

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Crabby View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crabby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2016 at 5:31pm
The mild warming of 0.6 to 0.8 C over the 20th century is well within the variations recorded in the last millennium.

https://www.friendsofscience.org/index.php?id=3

Also consider the fact that people like Al Gore have gotten rich off of their climate change investments into so called "green" companies. It's about MONEY and population control.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Satori Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2016 at 5:53pm
yeah
Al Gore leaves his porch light on even during the day
so therefore global warming is not happening
everyone can understand that "logic"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dutch Josh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2016 at 9:59pm
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-11-22/tpp-dies-asian-nations-salute-their-new-free-trade-leader-china Trump can say no to the Trans Pacific Partnership, North American Free Trade Asociation etc-but it is not clear what he has to offer instead. In export-oriented countries they now look for partners that do want to do business: China. 

Trump wants more US-energy, less rules-more fracking-the result will be even more earthquakes. 

Trump ignores climate-collapse, and of course the best way to get bigger problems is by ignoring them ! (Crabby; I would love to believe that climate change is not real-but evidence is different and getting devastating; sealevelrise will escalate within five years. Maybe some sort of feedback system in climatechange/global warming can change things but the way things are going now humans will be gone by 2030 or earlier).

Trump will be confronted with realities that are there; the US has spent billions/trillions in wars for oil to get an elite even richer. Clinton would continu on that destructive route. If Trump has an alternative he has to come up with realistic plans. Replacing middle-east/OPEC energy by US energy would go against the "free market" he claims to believe in. (The reason why the US did loose it position in energy during the 20th century is that productioncosts were much to high in the US.)

The US has "brains", innovation in energy (doing more with less-and reneweble-energy) is a challenge. But computer-driven, low energy electric cars build of new materials are the future. Bi-lateral trade-deals can be an alternative for globalism. 

Another risk in my opinion is "totalitarian democracy" in wich-company owned- main stream media claim that alternatives (like this forum) produce "fake news". All you do on the internet is monitored by the state. There is a group of people in power that have the arrogance to believe that they are always correct, have all the answers. 

Both in the US and Europe extreme right wing "politics" gain ground partly due to this arrogance. But also because an elite is funding these neo-fascist parties, neo-nazi's are fighting in the Ukraine (together with a.o. IS) against Russia. Hitler was funded by a (royal) elite that was afraid of the Soviet Union and atheïsm. Oil companies (and the Bush family, Henry Ford a.o.) paid the nazi's.

The last SS-unit fighting in Berlin may 1945 was the French SS-Charle-le-magne division. Nazism was widespread both in the US and Europe (including colonies). Voters can be manipulated so they are being manipulated-both in the US as elsewere. 

In Germany Merkel is the "moderate"experienced candidate running against "alternative-for-germany" (AfD) in elections in 2017. AfD may collapse under its own weight (or manipulation from outside). In France Marianne le Pen may face competition both from conservatives as from a "new left". Those races will be run the coming months. 

Trump will influence what is happening in Europe (and so will Putin). But the basics to build on are already here and the outcome of earlier decisions.
Que sera, sera, Whatever will be, will be, The future is not ours to see, Que sera, sera !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2016 at 11:46pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dutch Josh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2016 at 1:24am
CRS,DrPH, the article does not mention what to expect for the sealevelrise-lots of sources mention "that it will rise faster than expected" but since the polar regions are remote, satelite-data only gives limited information (so for exemple sea-water temperature at several levels under the sea-ice can only be very limited be measured by satelite) it is very hard to get more specific. 

Less land-ice means less pressure. The land-ice on Greenland was up to 3 kilometers, 1.8 mile thick. Less pressure means the underlying landmass will move up (by 1 kilometer if all the 3 kilometer of ice would go away). That gives seismic activity, earthquakes. 

Also layers in the seafloor, defrozen permafrost (also in mountains-partly glued together by ice=melt is collapse, landslides) on land react on temperatures getting above freezing with release of (a.o.) methane, but also water moving to the surface, sloppy grounds (buildings, roads, pipelines etc. getting unstable). 

Further fracking will cause superfractures. Oklahoma is being destroyed by the oil-industry (Dutchsinse did good reporting on this). Is the US waiting for a man-made (super)earthquake ? In the past I did discuss on this forum the maximum magnitude earthquakes can have by natural causes. The 9.5 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1960_Valdivia_earthquake had (proberbly for the most) natural causus. Fracking in sensitive US regions-close to faultlines wich gave strong earthquakes in the last centuries-partly overdue-and with global pressure redistribution-is not only a risk for the US !

Here in the Netherlands the oil/gas companies slowed down gas-exploitation because they had to pay for damages. Here the magnitude maximum was under 4. Further fracking in the US can turn the planet into a timebomb. I think a magnitude 10, maybe even up to 11 (?) is possible and that kind of earthquakes (also related super volcano's) is to much for any country to deal with. (It will effect rotation of the globe, give super-tsunami's, total destruction over thousends of kilometers.)

http://earthscience.stackexchange.com/questions/875/are-richter-magnitude-10-earthquakes-possible leaves out the human factors, fracking, massive landice-melt. A man-made faultline in combination with natural faultlines gives total new calculations-risks rise dramaticly ! (And I did not even mention underground nuclear testing....)
Que sera, sera, Whatever will be, will be, The future is not ours to see, Que sera, sera !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2016 at 7:20am
Thanks, Dutch Josh!  There are tons of articles, this one has a good animation showing what will happen to US coastal areas. 


Interestingly, the most impacted regions in the US are also the ones that voted against Donald Trump!! 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Satori Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2016 at 12:40pm
Two million more Americans voted for Hillary Clinton than for Donald Trump

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016...r-Donald-Trump


the "people's" choice was quite clear

#TrumpNot MyPresident
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 23 2016 at 2:58pm
Interesting story just breaking about "anomalies" in parts of battleground states that used electronic voting.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/jill-stein-prepares-to-request-election-recounts-in-battleground-states/ar-AAkG049?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=SL5IDHP




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"Any community that fails to prepare, with the expectation that the federal government will come to the rescue, will be tragically wrong." Michael Leavitt, HHS Secretary.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 25 2016 at 1:27pm

How long before the white working class realises Trump was just scamming them?

He hasn't even taken office yet and the broken promises are piling up

6K
trumpwhiteworkingclass.jpg

While we’re still analysing the election results and debating the importance of different factors to the final outcome, everyone agrees that white working class voters played a key part in Donald Trump’s victory, in some cases by switching their votes and in some cases by turning out when they had been nonvoters before.

And now that he’s about to take office, he’s ready to deliver on what he promised them, right? Well, maybe not so much:

President-elect Donald Trump abruptly abandoned some of his most tendentious campaign promises Tuesday, saying he does not plan to prosecute Hillary Clinton for her use of a private email system or the dealings of her family foundation, has an “open mind” about a climate-change accord from which he vowed to withdraw the United States and is no longer certain that torturing terrorism suspects is a good idea.

The billionaire real estate developer also dismissed any need to disentangle himself from his financial holdings, despite rising questions about how his global business dealings might affect his decision-making as the nation’s chief executive.

And it’s not just that; at the same time, the Trump administration and congressional Republicans are getting ready to move on their highest priorities, cutting taxes for the wealthy, scrapping oversight on Wall Street, and lightening regulations on big corporations.

Imagine you’re one of those folks who went to Trump rallies and thrilled to his promises to take America back from the establishment, who felt your heart stir as he promised to torture prisoners, who got your “Trump That Bitch” T-shirt, who was overjoyed to finally have a candidate who tells it like it is. What are you thinking as you watch this?

<

If you have any sense, you’re coming to the realisation that it was all a scam. You got played. While you were chanting “Lock her up!” he was laughing at you for being so gullible. While you were dreaming about how you’d have an advocate in the Oval Office, he was dreaming about how he could use it to make himself richer. He hasn’t even taken office yet and everything he told you is already being revealed as a lie.

During the campaign, Trump made two kinds of promises to those white working class voters. One was very practical, focused on economics. In coal country, he said he’d bring back all the coal jobs that have been lost to cheap natural gas (even as he promotes more fracking of natural gas; figure that one out). In the industrial Midwest, he said he’d bring back all the labour-intensive factory jobs that were mostly lost to automation, not trade deals. These promises were utterly ludicrous, but most of the target voters seemed not to care.

The second kind of promise was emotional and expressive. It was about turning back the clock to a time when immigrants hadn’t come to your town, when women weren’t so uppity, when you could say whatever you wanted and you didn’t feel like the culture and the economy were leaving you behind. So Trump said he’d toss Hillary Clinton in jail, force everyone to say “Merry Christmas” again, and sue those dastardly liberal news organisations into submission.

And of course, there were promises - like building a wall on the southern border and making Mexico pay for it just so they know who’s boss - that claimed to serve a practical purpose but also had an important expressive purpose. And now one by one Trump is casting them all off.

So what are we left with? What remains is Trump’s erratic whims, his boundless greed, and the core of Republican policies Congress will pursue, which are most definitely not geared toward the interests of working class whites. He can gut environmental regulations, but that doesn’t mean millions of people are going to head back to the coal mines - it was market forces more than anything else that led to coal’s decline. He can renegotiate trade deals, but that doesn’t mean that the labour-intensive factory jobs are coming back. And by the way, the high wages, good benefits, and job security those jobs used to offer? That was thanks to labour unions, which Republicans are now going to try to destroy once and for all.

Had Hillary Clinton won the election, the white working class might have gotten some tangible benefits - a higher minimum wage, overtime pay, paid family and medical leave, more secure health insurance, and so on. Trump and the Republicans oppose all that. So what did the white working class actually get? They got the election itself. They got to give a big middle finger to the establishment, to the coastal elites, to immigrants, to feminists, to college students, to popular culture, to political correctness, to every person and impersonal force they see arrayed against them. And that was it.

So what happens in two years when there’s a congressional election and two years after that when Trump runs for a second term? Those voters may look around and say, Hey wait a minute. That paradise of infinite winning Trump promised? It didn’t happen. My community still faces the same problems it did before. There’s no new factory in town with thousands of jobs paying great salaries. Everybody doesn’t have great health insurance with no cost-sharing for incredibly low premiums. I still hear people speaking Spanish from time to time. Women and minorities are still demanding that I treat them with respect. Music and movies and TV still make me feel like I’m being left behind. When Trump told me he’d wipe all that away, he was conning me. In fact, in many ways he was the fullest expression of the caricature of politicians (everything they say is a lie, they’re only out for themselves) I thought I was striking back against when I supported him.

President Trump protests

      Those voters may decide to vote for a Democrat next time. Or they may be demobilised, deciding that there isn’t much point to voting at all. The nearly all-white areas where turnout shot up in 2016 might settle right back down to where they used to be.

      Or maybe Trump will find a way to actually improve the lives of working class voters. That’s theoretically possible, but absolutely nothing he has done or said so far suggests that he has any idea how to do it, or even the inclination. So he may try to keep the fires of hatred, resentment, and fear burning, in the hopes that people forget that he hasn’t given them the practical things he said he would.

      The Washington Post

      12 monkeys!!!!!
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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crabby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 25 2016 at 6:51pm
      People will feel no different than when Obama scammed us by saying that he was going to be the most transparent president ever and then wasn't transparent at all.

      As for the supposed low cost health insurance that I was to get under Obamacare, it has almost doubled in the past 3 years! Nancy Pelosi, the democrat house speaker, told everyone that they had to pass the law to find out what was in it.

      Why should Donald Trump disentangle himself from his business holdings? He will eventually go back to being a private citizen again. Why should he give all of that up? He doesn't need an inside track in government to make more money than he already has. Using the government for their own purposes is more for people like the Clinton's and Obama who went into office with little and came out rich.

      I noticed that you quoted the Washington Post above. We don't call that paper the Washington Compost for nothing. Take a hint from that. This rag is pretty left of center these days.

      I have to wonder why someone from Australia should concern themselves with our election when they don't have any participation in it.
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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 25 2016 at 7:57pm
      ^although this hasn't been written about much, I believe that a critical factor of this election had to do with gun ownership and protecting the 2nd Amendment.  That alone may have been worth it to the group that voted for Trump.  

      It was a consideration of mine, but I reluctantly voted for Hillary out of concern for Trump's many conflicts of interest & the curious ties to Putin, which I'm waiting to see manifested in some type of move against NATO.  We shall see....
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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Satori Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 27 2016 at 1:25pm
      "hope and change" republican styleLOLLOLLOL

      grandma is gonna get thrown over a financial cliff
      too bad
      so sad

      Pay more and get less: The Ryan plan to privatize Medicare

      http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/11/27/1602925/-Pay-more-and-get-less-The-Ryan-plan-to-privatize-Medicare

      elections have consequences
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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 27 2016 at 3:13pm
      if you look the news item was from the UK........


      i do read what others say,

      about other countries ,

      keeps my mind.....

      OPEN......

      p.s

      dont tell anyone but i subscribe to the  Russian Times,have to know what the commie bastards are up to ....lol


      12 monkeys!!!!!
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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 27 2016 at 4:00pm
      Originally posted by Satori Satori wrote:

      Two million more Americans voted for Hillary Clinton than for Donald Trump

      http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016...r-Donald-Trump


      the "people's" choice was quite clear

      #TrumpNot MyPresident


      No, not necessarily. You are using the term Americans rather broadly. If you want to consider every person who is physically present in the U.S. an American, it isn't right. The people's choice does not include perhaps 7 million immigrants who voted illegally. In addition to these vote numbers are CNN and Fox generated numbers. When they were so dishonest in the polling numbers, do you think anything is going to be different as they try to get electors to change their votes.

      "Not my president" was the result of a billionaire investing money to back organized rallys around the U.S. with coaxing cards and bullhorns. Many of those people were political mercenaries paid to protest and the ads can be found all over the net.

      Suppose Trump had done the same thing. Days after Hillary was elected had people in the streets protesting she was "not our president"?

      He was the whiner remember. The person "not in contact with reality" for saying the election was rigged. And now we hear the same battle cry.

      Personally, I would be very afraid the day the Hillary Clinton becomes president. For one, she is likely to have us in a nuclear war in a matter of weeks. Her no fly zone in Syria would set off World War 3.

      The election was a Jerry Springer drama fest which failed to address the real issues, especially foregin policy. The foreign policy of the Democrats for 30 years on and off got us to where we are now with ISIS. We created ISIS just like we created the Mujhadeen to get Russia out of Afghanistan. Hillary has stated this in several videos I put up here.

      The bottom line is we need change. I would be afraid to have the same corrupt political swamp we have had for 50 years. The legislators are controlled by lobbyists who do not represent the people and are totally out of contact with the needs of Americans. 

      America would  not be great again with a criminal in office. There still will be investigations. Our inner cities would be in chaos with policeman being murdered and anarchy in the streets. Do you doubt this?

      It is time for a change. Let us hope we finally get it. Minorities have a right to their voice and to be heard, but we live in a democracy. It is for all the people, not just the really verbal and loud smaller groups with their personal agendas and programs. The Midwest and South and the workers were fed up with East Coast and West Coast running the country. It is time they were heard. The auto-workers, the coal miners, the heartland, the life and blood of our nation. They don't have time to protest. They are too busy working their butts off to make a living and survive. But they certainly had time to vote. And they did.

      Medclinician
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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2016 at 1:05am
      There are various estimates of how many people supposedly voted illegally, ranging from the number you quoted, to Trump's estimate of 3 million. None of those numbers have yet to be substantiated that I'm aware of, although they're being thrown out as fact.

      A right wing blogger called Greg Phillips is the most often quoted, but since he claimed three million votes had been fraudulently cast, he's been either unwilling or unable to provide any evidence to back it up. I'd be interested to see something more substantial than theories and suspicions. Do we have any links to reputable sites that can disprove the current popular vote count?








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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Satori Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2016 at 5:10am
      7 million illegal votes castLOL

      ok at this point people are just making up CRAP

      lets see some EVIDENCE please

      my state is TOTALLY dominated by Republicans
      they have been whining about voter "fraud" forever
      so far they have found exactly 6 votes that MAY have been cast illegally

      that's right
      6 out of over 4 million
      not 600,000
      not 60,000
      not 600
      not 60
      but SIX

      OFFICIAL counts at this point in time
      put Hillary 2 million votes ahead
      once again
      the PEOPLE clearly picked Clinton
      the electoral college picked Trump
      bottom line
      we're screwed
      climate change is going to be the BIGGEST issue we face
      and we have a climate change denier in the White House
      it's not gonna end well for us

      and as I have said
      personally speaking I fully expect another major economic collapse similar to or worse than the one that happened at the end of the Bush debacle

      now please excuse me
      I need to access some of my accounts on line
      and continue moving my money
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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2016 at 10:07am
      Originally posted by jacksdad jacksdad wrote:

      There are various estimates of how many people supposedly voted illegally, ranging from the number you quoted, to Trump's estimate of 3 million. None of those numbers have yet to be substantiated that I'm aware of, although they're being thrown out as fact.

      A right wing blogger called Greg Phillips is the most often quoted, but since he claimed three million votes had been fraudulently cast, he's been either unwilling or unable to provide any evidence to back it up. I'd be interested to see something more substantial than theories and suspicions. Do we have any links to reputable sites that can disprove the current popular vote count?


      He freakin' WON, what difference does it make? 

      There is no credible evidence of any large-scale voter fraud, the recount effort is stupid & a waste of time and money.  


      Trump is President, we have to deal with it.  Maybe it will be good, maybe not...he belongs to his voters and the GOP Congress now.  

      Personally, I think the guy is too erratic to be an effective President, but we have to go through the process.  I wonder if the GOP Congress will let him sell skyscrapers to Iran, N. Korea etc.?  He will if he can make a buck on it.  

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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2016 at 1:38pm
      I absolutely agree, Chuck, and nothing's going to change the result. But I'm just wondering if there is indeed any proof of widespread voter fraud numbering in the millions as is being claimed. Trump is currently lagging behind in the popular vote, but there are those who seem to be trying to muddy the water with what appears to be unsubstantiated accusations of illegal immigrants being organized to vote for his opponent. Just looking to get clarification, because nothing I'm seeing seems to support their assertion that Trump has either a majority, or a mandate.

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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Satori Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 28 2016 at 2:02pm
      yeah EVERYBODY gets it
      Trump won

      the Green Party is covering the cost of any recounts so taxpayers are off the hook last I heard anyway

      but the funny thing is even Trump himself is insisting the election was "rigged"
      he's the one claiming millions of illegal votes were cast
      yet he,like some others here has provided NO evidence

      I might add that the attacks on Trump are to be EXPECTED
      they are going to be CONTINUOUS
      and ya ain't seen nothin' yet

      remember when Obama was elected?
      what was the first thing out of that slimey sleaze bag Mitch McConnel's mouth ?
      he said the Republicans were going to do everything possible to see that he was a one term President
      and that they were going to fiercely oppose him on "everything"
      and they did

      some Democrats are advocating the exact same strategy with Trump
      what was good for the goose is good for the gander
      Trump is so thin skinned and  has has such a fragile ego that the next four years are going to be interesting

      the recount effort is of minor interest,it's not going to change anything
      what I am really concerned about is his not attending daily intelligence briefings
      the Republicans promise to gut Medicare
      and the fact that the big orange pumpkin head about to  stain the halls of the White House is a climate change denier
      and you will remember the fact that the last Republican President gave us the biggest economic collapse since the Great Depression
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      Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Satori Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 29 2016 at 10:57am
      Morons who voted for Republicans now worry they will take away their health care—as promised

      http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016...re-as-promised

      life is hard
      and its harder when your stupid

      they wanted it
      they voted for it
      and now its time to pay the piper
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