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Online Discussion: Tracking new emerging diseases and the next pandemic

The Great Outdoors and our Pets

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Rocky View Drop Down
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    Posted: January 24 2006 at 9:00pm
Here I am with more questions that may have no answers at this time.
But I would love opinions, gut reactions, etc.

1. If no one in your quaranteened household are is ill, is it OK for them to
be outdoors (playing, working, taking care of dogs, etc). Our nearest
neighbor is a half mile away.

2. If someone is ill in your household and everyone is doing everything
they can not to catch the virus, is it OK for them to be outdoors (see
above)

3. Would it be necessary in both the above scenarious to take off outdoor
clothing before coming into the house, putting the outdoor clothing into
a lidded container. I assume no shoes that have been worn outdoors
would enter the house. Could these same outdoor clothes be put on
outdoors and used again outdoors? Of course, at some point the outdoor
clothes would be washed. Immediately upon coming inside, hands would
be washed. Or should handwashing happen BEFORE entering the house?

Regarding contamination found outdoors I am thinking of possible wild
bird droppings, dead birds, etc. We have 60 acres, so have quite a bit of
wildlife activity. Any more outdoor contamination possibilities you can
think of? Along those lines, we have always fed wild birds, both close to
and about a half block (in city terms) from the house. Should bird feeding
be stopped altogether. What about hummingbird feeders?

4. Can dogs or cats catch the virus (dogs stay outside, cats stay inside). If
so, could they transmit it to humans? Dogs might play with a dead bird
that is infected or carry the virus on their paws from bird feces?

5. We have a pond (wildbird refuge was my hope). It has a small island in
the middle of it. During spring and summer it attracts a few wild ducks
who stay for a day or two. Also, other birds (robins, swallows) drink and
feed from it.

Thoughts? Many thanks. Rocky
Prepare for the Unexpected!
Rocky
http://www.homeemergencyusa.com
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2006 at 9:15pm

Rocky,

So many questions...

YES dogs & cats can get H5N1.  Cats seem to be especially susceptible to it at this point in time.  Not only can they get it but they can pass it to other cats in cages located near them.  There was research done on this and the researcher was shocked that his control cats caught H5N1 too and they were not infected directly nor were they in physical contact with the infected cats.  Needless to say, it caused quite a stir!  If you would like I will try and dig up a link or two on this tomorrow (it's midnight here).

Outside contamination... My dogs will have a dedicated, canopied place to do their business on a leash.  This will be the only time they will be allowed outside.  Exercise will be tennis balls down the hallway.  They will hate it (they are big dogs) but I will do what I must to protect them as diligently as I will protect the human members of my family. 

Disinfection...son will strip & shower in the garage, clothes will be dunked in soapy water (actively trying to think this through) before coming back in the house.  He will be our outlander, so he's our risk.

The dogs and people going into the yard will disinfect feet & paws at door.  Bleach solution.  I have gallons of olive oil that I will anoint their paws with after to prevent the bleach solution from tearing up their paws. (A tip from another kind poster).

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 25 2006 at 6:59am

I am training my grey taby cat to be a indoor cat (way harder than it sounds). This brings to me  my two worst fears  one is what will  happen to pets when this flu hits .  Yes the members on this board are more imformed and responsible than most people and will

provide for their pets .   

The second issue is  if the avaian flu dosent mutate  the normal next course of events is that the virus as is will come here by normal migration and will effect our birds  then our pets.  To me this virus is dangerous in its normal course not just the mutation.  The media seems to be focased on the what if this virus mutates to human to  human . Nobody is talking about what is going to happen next.    

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 25 2006 at 7:20am

I have a couple of cats. They are 100% indoor cats and are never allowed outdoors.   I even did their preps lol.  I have the best animal antiibioits on hand, along with extra Tamilfu for them.  

I also have 3000 cans of cat food and 600 pounds of dry food.   

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Deej View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Deej Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 25 2006 at 7:31am
rocky, i too live in the country and i plan on using as many outdoor resourses as i can.  we have a large deck off the back of our house with one section roofed, this section will be turned into a "clean area", boots, clothes etc will be deposited into a large bleach solution, boots disinfected with spray, and gloves & mask removed and disgarded. on top off the roof i am going to set our outdoor camping shower tp scrub up before coming in. hoping this will suffice.  i can not imagine not going outside.  will not have to worry too much about people, just birds and animals and i beleive with the proper care, it will be ok.  i do wonder about water .  plan on using a spring for water if preps run out, but i wonder about swimming in the river to bath ? anyone know if will be safe ? do not have any animals, thought about a dog, but took the advise of this forum and have decided to wait.
dee
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 26 2006 at 1:20pm

Does anyone know of a way of keeping off your roof, balcony N0n toxic please ,   There are at least four pigions on my roof  daily.

Thanks

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meewee View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote meewee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 26 2006 at 2:50pm

You can go down to any Lowe's, Home Depot, etc; and purchase a life-sized plastic owl. Owls are natural predators of pidgeons and they will disappear fast!  Get a couple and mount one on top of your house and another on your railing.

Meewee

God Bless us all!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TNbebo408 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 26 2006 at 8:17pm
Put a big rubber snake on the roof, and the birdies will be gonnies, they scared to death of a snake, ME TOO.
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jackson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 26 2006 at 10:41pm
Hi,
I have two cats and never considered the possibility that they might contract the bird flu. No one on TV (at least to my knowledge) had addressed the problem of pets getting the flu!  Has anyone heard what the mortality rate is in animals other than birds??
How much food and water would be enough for cats?  I have been buying extra cans of cat food during each trip to the store. And i've bought extra cans for neigbors who have cats and even some cans of dog food for neighbors who have dogs (even though i don't own any dogs myself). I know that if people start running out of food, the welfare of their pets will cease to be a major concern. I have tried to warn them to prepare but they dont' take it seriously and feel the have enough time to get to the grocery store once a pandemic starts. (i am sure most people in our town are thinking that). 

Any advice on the amt of water to store for two cats... five if you include my neighbor's outdoor cats? 

thanks,
Millie a Jackson

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Riaa View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Riaa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 29 2006 at 7:41pm
Hi...I live in the country..but in town..I have cats...i'm planing to keep the outdoors cats on a screened in proch..I found a dead Bat..yesterday..What about BATS...we have alot of them here...Will they get it ?  like Birds...    Yipes !!!  
       
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Luna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 25 2006 at 8:30am
I posted this on another thread but thought it should go here too:
 
Remember that there is almost no chance that your dogs will get this flu. The dog flu (that came from horses) that is making the rounds in the US now is the first documented flu virus that dogs have ever caught. And once the bird flu mutates to human flu, we'll only be able to catch it from other people. The only possible case of a dog with bird flu is obviously not proven as it doesn't show up on the WHO's timeline of cases. If wild birds bring H5N1 to the US it will still only be a flu that effects birds, not other animals or humans. Unless it mutates to adapt to another species here. And that's rare. Cats seem to be more prone to catching the bird flu, so it's wise to keep cats indoors when H5N1 shows up here in wild birds. But that's so people lesson the chance of their cats either possibly catching the flu and dying or acting as a mixing vessel and then giving it to people. That seems even more unlikely as I haven't heard (though I haven't researched) of any humans ever catching a flu virus from a cat. Cats certainly spread a lot of nasties to people, but not flu.
 
Flu viruses very, very, very rarely jump species. So don't worry too much about cats/dogs/birds/bats, etc. even when the bird flu jumps to people. There will be almost no chance other species, besides humans, will be spreading it around.
 
 
 
Remember, when wild birds arrive here with H2N1 it's still only a bird illness. But, since some (very rare occasion) cats, who've had very, very, very close contact with H2N1 have caught it, it would be a good idea to keep your cats inside, for their safety, (and to limit the chance it would mutate) not really yours. A pandemic is not going to be spread by birds or other animals. Only by other people. It's a very rare occurance for a flu virus to mutate enough to jump species and become easily transmissable. Because there is so much H2N1 now in some Asian countries where people have extremely close contact with it, that has vastly increased the chance it will mutate and start spreading to people, in Asia. When/if it does mutate we'll see it coming, probably several weeks, if not months before it gets to the US. The wild birds flying around (or other wild animals or domestic pets) will not be spreading the new mutated virus. Only other people will be spreading it. Of course, there is always the remotest chance that wild birds giving it to domestic poultry in the US may cause a mutation to happen here. But that is extremely unlikely. Look how many years this strain of H2N1 took to get to this point and under the incredible crowding and close contact that poultry has with people in Asia, that just shows how difficult and rare it is.
 
If the virus mutates, and if people in your community start to catch it, you need to avoid contact with people. The virus, when coughed out by someone who is sick, can float around in the air and if you inhale it you may catch it. How far and how long it floats around is questionable. And you'll be able to catch it if you touch things that sick people, with germy hands have touched, and then you touch your nose or face.
 
When/if a mutated virus gets here, it will probably be much less lethal than H2N1 is now, if going by historical data.  But....if it's still pretty lethal, and if people in my town or neighborhood start catching it, I plan to be prepared, have supplies and stay at home. I will also limit my time outdoors as it's hard to know (and science doesn't seem to be able to clarify) if the wind could blow the sick neighbor's germs to me. But I live in a sparsely populated area. I might be more careful if I lived in a city or with close neighbors. I won't be worried about my dog at all. I will be very careful with my cockatoos. They won't be allowed out of the house, I will wash well and remove my shoes before going in their room. Otherwise, I don't believe anything more than that is necessary or advisable.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 11 2006 at 7:00pm

 Puppy 2 

Biologycal Hazard - North-America

Event summary
GLIDE Number BH-20060609-6363-USA    
Event type Biologycal Hazard Date / time 09/06/2006 - 08:56:20 (Military Time, UTC)
Country USA Area -
County / State California City Los Angeles
Cause of event Unknow Log date 09/06/2006 - 08:56:20 (Military Time, UTC)
Damage level Not or Not data Time left
Latitude: N 34 6.675 Longitude: W 118 27.009
Number of deaths: Not or Not data Number of injured persons: Not or Not data

DESCRIPTION
A rare outbreak of dog flu has swept through a kennel in southern California, raising concerns over the possible spread of an untreatable virus, animal control officials said on Thursday. The disease, a type A influenza virus called H3N8 by scientists, is believed to have mutated from a horse flu common at racetracks where it leapt to greyhound dogs in the state of Florida in 2000. The virus, however, does not appear to be transferable humans, experts said. No vaccine is currently available for the dog flu, and it cannot be treated by any specific drug, said Dunne. The flu spread like wildfire at the facility run by Canine Companions for Independence, an organisation that pairs trained dogs with the disabled that is based in Oceanside, a small town south of Los Angeles. Two dogs have tested positive for the virus and the 62 other dogs in the kennel are displaying characteristic symptoms of coughing and sneezing. All dogs at the facility have been quarantined. While humans are not thought to be at immediate risk from the virus, influenza changes continuously and further species mutation cannot be completely ruled out, Dunne warned.






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Samoa View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Samoa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: June 17 2006 at 12:08pm
There's someting that I haven't thought of.  Say the BF recombines with a dog or a cat virus.  Birds carrying it is one thing, but getting into animals that we closely interact with is something else.
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