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Online Discussion: Tracking new emerging diseases and the next pandemic

Europe-Black Lung- Flu mutation spreads - Event Date: November 12 2009

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Calendar Event: Europe-Black Lung- Flu mutation spreads
    Posted: November 18 2009 at 12:28pm
Needing more confirmation but main stream - not only is the Swine Flu increasing - but also the tag along undefined respiratory bug which may be the same as the in the Ukraine. More confirmation needed. This is a significant event. This can be explained away as it is common for these disease to occur together- but this may be one of the first incidence of this outside Ukraine and this is translated from Norwegian

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aftenposten.no%2Fhelse%2Farticle3368591.ece&sl=no&tl=en&history_state0=

630,000 Norwegians flu infected

We estimate that just under 630,000 Norwegians are now infected and that nearly half a million were infected just last week.

you must surf to page to read this in English.. I am going to  translate (capturing parts of google trans) .. to see if I can get the text - on here posted in case the link dies.

 Wednesday evening FHI reported that the number of infected people is 900,000, and the number of infected last week 500,000.  This was due to a miscalculation by the Department.
 The entire 13 per cent of Norway's population is now infected with the swine flu. The estimates of Public Health (FHI) for the latest updated situation report that was published late Wednesday night.

 Both the incidence of influenza-like illness and the number of confirmed flu cases has increased sharply throughout the country in recent weeks. But last week was a steep upward curve.
 According to the NIPH was all as many as 300,000 Norwegians infected with swine flu only last week.

 The article continues below the video window.

We estimate that just under 630,000 Norwegians are now infected and that nearly half a million were infected just last week.  There are a large number and it tells us that we are in the middle of a new and powerful wave of infection which is significantly stronger than the one we had this summer, "said Hans Blystad, superintendent at the NIPH.

He will not mean anything if, or when, we can expect to reach a temporary peak of infection, but said a leveling off of the number of new infected first is probably when even more is vaccinated.

Infection estimates of the NIPH is based on reported cases in the last week from 201 physician offices spread across the country, including laboratory tests and how many were diagnosed with "influenza-like illness".

 14 percent of those who went to the doctor last week had this diagnosis.Of the tests that were done in more detail in the laboratory showed all samples swine influenza virus.

Svineinfluensavirset has now spread epidemic in the whole country, and is most extensive in the Southeast and West Coast.

 So far, 772 Norwegians hospitalized in connection with the swine flu pandemic.94 received intensive treatment, and 16 are dead. . 13 of them died in hospital.Yesterday was the 93 people hospitalized, and 20 in intensive care.

comment: this is a 2% CFR of those hospitalized

 Deputy Health Director Bjorn Guldvog believe that the number of infected in Norway will increase.

We believe we are on a rising wave in the number of infected people.But soon, almost all the risk groups vaccinated, so we hope for a avflating in the number of critically ill and died, "said Guldvog.

see link for full translation is link remains stable

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2009 at 11:53am
The unusual illness I first started posting on recently is still continuing to spread.

Sharp Rise of 300,000 Norwegians Infected with Swine Flu Last Week.

Swine flu A/H1N1 spreads quickly but is largely mild. It is way milder than seasonal flu. In fact, a lot of people recover without seeing the doctor. The mortality rate is far lower than that of seasonal flu too. So, we must not submit to the fear mongering of the pharmaceutical cartel. I am highlighting this case, because I believe swine flu is bio-engineered. Coupled with the hemorrhagic pneumonia of Ukraine, we need to keep an eye on unusual flu ‘events’.

They backtracked on there original numbers which were

This was the original numbers given.

Wednesday evening FHI reported that the number of infected people is 900,000, and the number of infected last week 500,000. This was due to a miscalculation by the Department.
 
The entire 13 per cent of Norway’s population is now infected with the swine flu. The estimates of Public Health (FHI) for the latest updated situation report that was published late Wednesday night.
 
Both the incidence of influenza-like illness and the number of confirmed flu cases has increased sharply throughout the country in recent weeks. Men i forrige uke gikk kurven bratt oppover. But last week was a steep upward curve.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2009 at 11:56am
The same spin is spreading as the unidentified (but known to authorities illness) continues. Despite the fact it may be a completely different pathogen not ruling out pneumonic plague- we continue to hear mutated H1N1. Considered they fought for so long to insist that H1N1 had not mutated - this is odd, since I posted 5 instances of mutated H1N1 especially in Brazil.

Now the new spin is everywhere it is a Swine flu mutations. What is not posted is the new strain may be completely resistant to the current vaccine made based on the California strain.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2009 at 12:22pm
how these old hidden accounts seem to blossom forth Wink

Beware of the pneumonic plague carrying Norwegian Rat

http://ajp.amjpathol.org/cgi/reprint/174/3/910.pdf




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2009 at 3:40pm
Swine Flu Mutation May Make Disease More Severe, Norway Says

By Marianne Stigset

Nov. 20 (Bloomberg) -- Norway’s Institute of Public Health discovered a mutated form of the H1N1 influenza virus that may make it more prone to infect deeper in the airways and cause more severe disease.

The mutated virus has been detected in two patients who died of the flu and one who was severely ill with the disease out of 70 cases tested, the institute said today in a statement.

“Based on what we know so far, it seems that the mutated virus does not circulate in the population, but might be a result of spontaneous changes which have occurred in these three patients,” Geir Stene-Larsen, the head of the institute, said in the statement. “There is no indication that this change in the virus is of any importance for the effect of the vaccine or the effect of antiviral treatment.”

Norway has had an estimated 700,000 cases of infections of H1N1, with 21 reported deaths. The Institute of Public Health estimates about 25 percent of the population of about 4.7 million to be at risk of contagion.

“It’s most likely that the virus’s capability to mutate is not just specific to Norway; it will occur in other countries as well,” Stene-Larsen said in an interview on broadcaster TV2 today.

To contact the reporter on this story: Marianne Stigset in Oslo at mstigset@bloomberg.net

Last Updated: November 20, 2009 11:58 EST

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 20 2009 at 3:59pm
http://www.philly.com/philly/wires/ap/news/world/20091120_ap_whoinvestigatingnorwayswineflumutations.html

Posted on Fri, Nov. 20, 2009


WHO investigating Norway swine flu mutations

The Associated Press

GENEVA - The World Health Organization said Friday it is investigating samples of variant swine flu linked to two deaths and one severe case in Norway, but that so far the significance of the mutation is unclear.

Norway's Institute of Public Health announced Friday that the mutation "could possibly...cause more severe disease" because it infects tissue deeper in the airway than usual.

The mutation was found in three of 70 analyzed swine flu cases, said Geir Stene-Larsen, the institute's director.

Stene-Larsen said he does not believe the mutant virus is circulating in the general population in Norway, where about 680,000 people are estimated to have been infected with swine flu to date and 23 have died.

The same mutation has been found in both fatal and mild cases elsewhere, including in Brazil, China, Japan, Mexico, Ukraine, and the United States, said WHO.

In addition, "worldwide, viruses from numerous fatal cases have not shown the mutation," the global body said. "The public health significance of this finding is thus unclear."

"Just to say that the mutated virus infects deeper tissue doesn't really tell us very much," WHO spokesman Thomas Abraham told The Associated Press. "What we really need is more clinical and epidemiological data."

WHO said the anti-viral drugs still appear to be effective against viruses with the mutation, and studies show that currently available pandemic vaccines confer protection against the variant strain.

Virus mutations occur spontaneously and many have no effect on the danger a virus poses to humans.

"Although further investigation is under way, no evidence currently suggests that these mutations are leading to an unusual increase in the number of H1N1 infections or a greater number of severe or fatal cases," said WHO.

Meanwhile the Geneva-based agency updated its global tally of deaths caused by the virus to over 6,750.

It said transmissions appear to have peaked in some parts of the United States and Western Europe, but elsewhere the number of cases is still increasing, including in eastern Europe, and Central and Western Asia.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abcdefg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2009 at 3:31am
It  was never in doubt that the virus would eventually mutate, however it did not mutate in Brazil. At least according to Brazil it did not.
 
Our of  seven hundred thousand cases of flu,  16  are dead, mutatted or not, this is not a major killer disease at this point. Missing are any reports of pre-existing conditions.
 
But it sure has a nice death and  scare ring to it, does it not?
 
The lunatic is on the grass.
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Remembering games and daisy chains and laughs.
Got to keep the loonies on the path.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2009 at 5:05am
Originally posted by abcdefg abcdefg wrote:

It  was never in doubt that the virus would eventually mutate, however it did not mutate in Brazil. At least according to Brazil it did not.
 
Our of  seven hundred thousand cases of flu,  16  are dead, mutatted or not, this is not a major killer disease at this point. Missing are any reports of pre-existing conditions.
 
But it sure has a nice death and  scare ring to it, does it not?
 
The lunatic is on the grass.
The lunatic is on the grass.
Remembering games and daisy chains and laughs.
Got to keep the loonies on the path.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

According to my research yesterday not only did it mutate in Brazil, that mutation has spread. You need to back off on the personal attacks and focus on science. Argue with WHO and stop posting gibberish. You are not destroying my credibility- you are destroying your own.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp/091120/health/health_flu_who_mutation

Mutation found in swine flu virus: WHO



GENEVA (AFP) - The World Health Organisation said Friday that a mutation had been found in samples of the swine flu virus taken following the first two deaths from the pandemic in Norway.

if(window.yzq_d==null)window.yzq_d=new Object(); window.yzq_d['.KTlBkSO5_I-']='&U=13gi1fcdm%2fN%3d.KTlBkSO5_I-%2fC%3d753512.13772434.13804887.11107163%2fD%3dLREC%2fB%3d5916109%2fV%3d1';

However, it stressed that the mutation did not appear to cause a more contagious or more dangerous form of A(H1N1) influenza and that some similar cases observed elsewhere had been mild.

"The Norwegian Institute of Public Health has informed WHO of a mutation detected in three H1N1 viruses," the WHO said in a briefing note.

"The viruses were isolated from the first two fatal cases of pandemic influenza in the country and one patient with severe illness," it said, although it added that no further instances were found in tests.

"Norwegian scientists have analysed samples from more than 70 patients with clinical illness and no further instances of this mutation have been detected. This finding suggests that the mutation is not widespread in the country," the UN health agency explained.

WHO spokesman Gregory Haertl told AFP that the global health watchdog did not believe "that this has any significant impact for the time being."

However, the agency revealed that a similar mutation had been observed in Brazil, China, Japan, Mexico, Ukraine, and the United States, as early as April.

comment: you are mistaken for lack of better research.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2009 at 5:16am
Originally posted by abcdefg abcdefg wrote:

It  was never in doubt that the virus would eventually mutate, however it did not mutate in Brazil. At least according to Brazil it did not.
 
Our of  seven hundred thousand cases of flu,  16  are dead, mutatted or not, this is not a major killer disease at this point. Missing are any reports of pre-existing conditions.
 
But it sure has a nice death and  scare ring to it, does it not?
 
The lunatic is on the grass.
The lunatic is on the grass.
Remembering games and daisy chains and laughs.
Got to keep the loonies on the path.


Deb- this aversion of yours is delusional. The same style and spin seems to be present in several different users. Read the data in my posts. One- my mental health is fine and two

NEW VIRUS TYPE BEING TESTED
Swine Flu Virus Mutated, Experts Afraid
A new virus strain has been discovered in Brazil, the A/Sao Paolo/1454/H1N1, but it has not been determined how dangerous it is.

comment: It mutated in Brazil.

http://www.javno.com/en-world/swine-flu-virus-mutated-experts-afraid_265913

I prefer science to government denials.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Loribearme Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 21 2009 at 1:47pm
http://www.examiner.com/x-29228-LA-Health-Technology-Examiner~y2009m11d21-H1N1-mutation-in-Norway--Increased-patient-fatalities-due-to-more-dangerous-strain-of-the-swine-flu
H1N1 mutation in Norway - Increased patient fatalities due to more dangerous strain of the swine flu
Wearing%20a%20Flu%20Mask%20can%20Protect%20against%20H1N1%20Virus
Wearing a Flu Mask can Protect against H1N1 Virus
AP Photo/Nick Ut

Doctors in Norway have identified H1N1 mutations in genetic material from patients with fatal swine flu infections. The mutated H1N1 virus caused severe symptoms, and were found in patients that died early in the flu outbreak. Health authorities believe that there is no evidence of transmission of these mutated viruses to other humans, but similar mutations have been seen in other countries, including Mexico, the United States, and in the Ukraine. According to the World Health Organization, this is the result of spontaneous changes in the virus in each host.

Symptoms of Swine Flu Mutation

The swine flu mutation found in Norway resulted in severe respiratory distress. The Norwegian Institute of Public Health stated that the mutation gave the virus a greater ability to affect the respiratory system, allowing it to cause more damage. Ukraine flu symptoms reportedly include bleeding in the lungs.

Impact of H1N1 mutation on Norway

According to Geir Stene-Larsen, the director of Norway's Institute of Public Health, this mutation was only found in three cases, out of the 70 swine flu cases that were analyzed. Two of those cases resulted in the death of the patient. 

Related Information:

Ukraine virus update - flu deaths rise to 354, but Ukraine Health Officials plan to lift quarantine

FDA Panel rejects FluBlok, faster flu vaccine production - 75 days to vaccination from new flu virus

Ukraine Flu Outbreak

October batch of H1N1 vaccine recalled by manufacturer - GlaxoSmithKline reports side effect dangers

Ukraine virus : H1N1 and Parainfluenza makes a deadly combination as Ukraine flu outbreak worsens

function getUrlParam(name) { name = name.replace(/[\[]/,"\\\[").replace(/[\]]/,"\\\]"); var regexS = "[\\?&]"+name+"=([^&#]*)"; var regex = new RegExp( regexS ); var results = regex.exec( window.location.href ); if( results == null ) return ""; else return results[1]; } var src = "http://ad.doubleclick.net/adj/cdg.examiner.Philadelphia/Health;kw=;exid=29228;source=11;pos=10;category=Life;edition=Philadelphia;section=Health;tile=10;sz=160x31;ord=insertordhere?"; var src = src.replace("insertordhere", ord); var splitResult = src.split(";"); var finalResult = ""; for(i = 0; i < splitResult.length; i++ finalResult = finalResult + splitResult; if(i+1 != splitResult.length) { finalResult = finalResult + ";"; } if(i+1 == 5) { finalResult = finalResult + "adtest=" + getUrlParam('adtest') + ";"; } } document.write('< ="1.1" ="'+finalResult+'" >'); < =1.1 ="http://ad.doubleclick.net/adj/cdg.examiner.Philadelphia/Health;kw=;exid=29228;source=11;pos=10;adtest=;category=Life;edition=Philadelphia;section=Health;tile=10;sz=160x31;ord=2887926941881117?"> Click%20here%20to%20find%20out%20more!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 6:36am
Originally posted by Loribearme Loribearme wrote:

http://www.examiner.com/x-29228-LA-Health-Technology-Examiner~y2009m11d21-H1N1-mutation-in-Norway--Increased-patient-fatalities-due-to-more-dangerous-strain-of-the-swine-flu
H1N1 mutation in Norway - Increased patient fatalities due to more dangerous strain of the swine flu


Lori, you were lucky to find this article. I am seeing a blackout as of November 20, 2009 and am going to go off mainstream to find much more I think.

What is really lacking here is maps and charts of the new disease or strain as well as definitive statements. This is the shape of things to come for the U.S.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote reality check Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 6:49am
Originally posted by Medclinician Medclinician wrote:

Originally posted by Loribearme Loribearme wrote:

http://www.examiner.com/x-29228-LA-Health-Technology-Examiner~y2009m11d21-H1N1-mutation-in-Norway--Increased-patient-fatalities-due-to-more-dangerous-strain-of-the-swine-flu
H1N1 mutation in Norway - Increased patient fatalities due to more dangerous strain of the swine flu


Lori, you were lucky to find this article. I am seeing a blackout as of November 20, 2009 and am going to go off mainstream to find much more I think.

What is really lacking here is maps and charts of the new disease or strain as well as definitive statements. This is the shape of things to come for the U.S.

Medclinician
 
 
 
gee Med...thats the exact same rag(examiner) that in another post you use as reference and claim to be your home town rag.Quite a "find" indeed. It's a NATIONAL rag.Med...RC(other reference to examiner was the norway rat thread..just last night.Sorry Med but you make this too easy not to question.RC
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 7:02am
Originally posted by reality check reality check wrote:

Quite a "find" indeed. It's a NATIONAL rag.Med...RC


This was posted earlier in this thread. http://www.philly.com/philly/wires/ap/news/world/20091120_ap_whoinvestigatingnorwayswineflumutations.html

Posted on Fri, Nov. 20, 2009


WHO investigating Norway swine flu mutations

The Associated Press

Is there a problem here with information from WHO, the AP, or the Philadelphia media. Please stay on topic in terms of the content of the Norway swine flu mutations and once again- refrain from personal comments and attacks on the posters.  I am putting in two more complaints on your continuing efforts to corrupt and throw genuine news threads off track.

John Bell R.N. West Virginia and California (inactive in CA)

CEO Crystalware Defense/ Scientific Researcher

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lightoftruth Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 7:08am
RC,, other than being disruptive, what exactly does your comment relating to Med's local paper have to do with swine flu?? Please tell us what profound insight it brings to the discussion????
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 7:13am
Seattle Times - Mainstream Media

Originally published Friday, November 20, 2009 at 10:10 AM

WHO investigating Norway swine flu mutations

The World Health Organization said Friday it is investigating samples of variant swine flu linked to two deaths and one severe case in Norway, but that so far the significance of the mutation is unclear.

The Associated Press

GENEVA —

The World Health Organization said Friday it is investigating samples of variant swine flu linked to two deaths and one severe case in Norway, but that so far the significance of the mutation is unclear.

Norway's Institute of Public Health announced Friday that the mutation "could possibly...cause more severe disease" because it infects tissue deeper in the airway than usual.

The mutation was found in three of 70 analyzed swine flu cases, said Geir Stene-Larsen, the institute's director.

Stene-Larsen said he does not believe the mutant virus is circulating in the general population in Norway, where about 680,000 people are estimated to have been infected with swine flu to date and 23 have died.

The same mutation has been found in both fatal and mild cases elsewhere, including in Brazil, China, Japan, Mexico, Ukraine, and the United States, said WHO.

In addition, "worldwide, viruses from numerous fatal cases have not shown the mutation," the global body said. "The public health significance of this finding is thus unclear."

"Just to say that the mutated virus infects deeper tissue doesn't really tell us very much," WHO spokesman Thomas Abraham told The Associated Press. "What we really need is more clinical and epidemiological data."

WHO said the anti-viral drugs still appear to be effective against viruses with the mutation, and studies show that currently available pandemic vaccines confer protection against the variant strain.

Virus mutations occur spontaneously and many have no effect on the danger a virus poses to humans.

"Although further investigation is under way, no evidence currently suggests that these mutations are leading to an unusual increase in the number of H1N1 infections or a greater number of severe or fatal cases," said WHO.

Meanwhile the Geneva-based agency updated its global tally of deaths caused by the virus to over 6,750.

It said transmissions appear to have peaked in some parts of the United States and Western Europe, but elsewhere the number of cases is still increasing, including in eastern Europe, and Central and Western Asia.

John Bell- CEO Crystalware Defense - Medical and Technology Research
aka Medclinician author of Pandemic Now Survival Guide


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote reality check Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 7:15am
Originally posted by Medclinician Medclinician wrote:

Originally posted by reality check reality check wrote:

Quite a "find" indeed. It's a NATIONAL rag.Med...RC


This was posted earlier in this thread. http://www.philly.com/philly/wires/ap/news/world/20091120_ap_whoinvestigatingnorwayswineflumutations.html

Posted on Fri, Nov. 20, 2009


WHO investigating Norway swine flu mutations

The Associated Press

Is there a problem here with information from WHO, the AP, or the Philadelphia media. Please stay on topic in terms of the content of the Norway swine flu mutations and once again- refrain from personal comments and attacks on the posters.  I am putting in two more complaints on your continuing efforts to corrupt and throw genuine news threads off track.

John Bell R.N. West Virginia and California (inactive in CA)

CEO Crystalware Defense/ Scientific Researcher

 
 
Look Med...I read your "original post(thanks to Tech) ,this morning and it now appears you have hired "people" to find me in Canada.That infers stalking and with your past easilly accessable just by searching google you may want to reconsider. As far as complaints about me...get in lineWinkRC
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 7:20am



Originally published Friday, November 20, 2009 at 10:10 AM

WHO investigating Norway swine flu mutations

The World Health Organization said Friday it is investigating samples of variant swine flu

comment: This indicates WHO at least is stating we have a variant of swine flu- mutation

linked to two deaths and one severe case in Norway, but that so far the significance of the mutation is unclear.

The Associated Press

GENEVA —

The World Health Organization said Friday it is investigating samples of variant swine flu linked to two deaths and one severe case in Norway, but that so far the significance of the mutation is unclear.

Norway's Institute of Public Health announced Friday that the mutation "could possibly...cause more severe disease" because it infects tissue deeper in the airway than usual.

The mutation was found in three of 70 analyzed swine flu cases, said Geir Stene-Larsen, the institute's director.

Stene-Larsen said he does not believe the mutant virus is circulating in the general population in Norway, where about 680,000 people are estimated to have been infected with swine flu to date and 23 have died.

The same mutation has been found in both fatal and mild cases elsewhere, including in Brazil, China, Japan, Mexico, Ukraine, and the United States, said WHO.

In addition, "worldwide, viruses from numerous fatal cases have not shown the mutation," the global body said. "The public health significance of this finding is thus unclear."

"Just to say that the mutated virus infects deeper tissue doesn't really tell us very much," WHO spokesman Thomas Abraham told The Associated Press. "What we really need is more clinical and epidemiological data."

WHO said the anti-viral drugs still appear to be effective against viruses with the mutation, and studies show that currently available pandemic vaccines confer protection against the variant strain.

Virus mutations occur spontaneously and many have no effect on the danger a virus poses to humans.

"Although further investigation is under way, no evidence currently suggests that these mutations are leading to an unusual increase in the number of H1N1 infections or a greater number of severe or fatal cases," said WHO.

Meanwhile the Geneva-based agency updated its global tally of deaths caused by the virus to over 6,750.

It said transmissions appear to have peaked in some parts of the United States and Western Europe, but elsewhere the number of cases is still increasing, including in eastern Europe, and Central and Western Asia.


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John Bell- CEO Crystalware Defense - Medical and Technology Research
aka Medclinician author of Pandemic Now Survival Guide
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote reality check Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 7:21am
Originally posted by lightoftruth lightoftruth wrote:

RC,, other than being disruptive, what exactly does your comment relating to Med's local paper have to do with swine flu?? Please tell us what profound insight it brings to the discussion????
 
No problem Light....last night he used the exact same source and story regarding norway rats flu mutation and then this morning lorri states exact same article and source and Med says good find  and how since nov20 there has been a blackout on that story. It just does not make sense>RC
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 8:29am
Originally posted by reality check reality check wrote:

It just does not make sense>RC


Doing the search with one engine I am getting a lot of 11/20 data as WHO goes into this investigating and stating there has been a mutation. At the same time they are covering their back with it won't effect the vaccine. Then further on they state they really can't predict what will happen in the future.

Well, either they can or can't predict- and they can't. They keep wanting to jump ahead and say no matter how this mutates don't worry, the vaccine will still handle it. We have 3 resistant instances to Tamiflu and if this changes enough the vaccine- which hasn't even proved effective against the original strain- please site me a link saying where it has and don't use pretzel logic as to well- they haven't proved it doesn't. Look at the stakes here, the money, the lives. You don't go charging in with untested vaccine (they had to test some-that is where they got the side effects) for a flu which is not that dangerous and force everyone to take it.

This is basic common sense. And a lot of the public statements which are a muddle of political ambiguities don't cut it.

You are not going into this as a scientist. You have had this slant since day one no matter what breaks out, it won't be that bad, we can handle it, and we don't need to prep. You are playing for the wrong choir. People are here because I think many at least consider it a potential threat, they want to know how to prep, and you are not being scientific- you are nit picking.

It mutated. Its like I told abcdefg. It mutated in Brazil. I posted a huge thread with scientists, sequences, and even to the strand. People were jumping right over the science and just saying.. well.. I just don't believe it.

You already have your mind made up. We just keep looking for more data.

Thanks to those that keep looking with us together.

John Bell- CEO Crystalware Defense - Medical and Technology Research
aka Medclinician author of Pandemic Now Survival Guide


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 1NiceGuy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November 22 2009 at 8:44am
Med,
Still following your posts and appreciate all the work you do.
"Chance favors the prepared mind."
Louis Pasteur

-- Louis Pasteur
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