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Online Discussion: Tracking new emerging diseases and the next pandemic; Now tracking the Aussie Flu.

What happend to Avian Flu Talk?

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Medclinician View Drop Down
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    Posted: August 04 2017 at 6:49am
Albert, I know that I am as guilty as anyone for turning this site in a place where in the main disease discussion area there is little on disease, the Flu, or anything useful of how to prepare for a Pandemic.

We used to say at family dinners, don't talk about religion or politics and try not to let a few of the more rowdy ones get too drunk and things would be fine.

We have huge differences of opinion and ideas about religion and politics. As this had done in our government and the world, in some way Avian Flu Talk is not fun anymore. Perhaps disease and pestilence are exactly fun, but I will post this openly for you consideration.  Can we move all discussion that have nothing to do with health, disease, or outbreak into their own area?

I can tell you though, that the media and government has tightened down its media control and where we once knew where there were outbreaks sites do not show up on Google or have scary warnings that they are dangerous.

There is an outbreak in Burma right now of H1N1 and people are dying. It is nowhere on the mainstream at all. Ebola, dangerous new viruses and outbreaks still are happening all over the world, but government don't want their tourist trade hurt so they suppress reporting.

The fact that there are super bugs which are immune to everything, Norovirus is year round, and food poisoning and other issues are still killing people.

I miss it. I really do.

I find myself wrapped up in emotional stuff where much of the news is pure fiction. It really is.

Thank you to all my friends here and even those who I cross swords with many times. If I were the head of North Korea, and crazy, I would be thinking bioweapon. We know they have been experimenting with them for decades and we know that people from Pakistan and other dark figures have developed doomsday Hantavirus and other nasty stuff that could wipe out most everyone and yet not harm a building or structure.

A genetically engineered virus to target all races except perhaps people of one group could not be retaliated against.

Albert, remember when we valiantly cover the 2009 Pandemic and just before I posted - not if but when. Those were the days, my friend.

I hate politics. I always did. I am neither party and I think they are all crooks really. No one in either party has addressed the issue of defense against our greatest threat to America - a bioweapon attack.

Those were the days my friend.

Medclinician


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arirish View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote arirish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2017 at 6:55am
It seems to me that this happens every summer! Flu hits the summer lull and we discuss everything else!
Buy more ammo!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2017 at 7:02am
Originally posted by arirish arirish wrote:

It seems to me that this happens every summer! Flu hits the summer lull and we discuss everything else!


Perhaps so. I have been searching for some type of news on Flu or any type of disease. It is Flu season in Australia and they have just stopped reporting it.

Med

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote arirish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2017 at 7:59am
I just posted to Avian Flu forum about a single case of H7N9 in Fujian. Not exactly a hunker down scenario! But cheer up! They're having earthquakes in Oklahoma and it's hurricane season!
Buy more ammo!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2017 at 11:43am
Originally posted by arirish arirish wrote:

I just posted to Avian Flu forum about a single case of H7N9 in Fujian. Not exactly a hunker down scenario! But cheer up! They're having earthquakes in Oklahoma and it's hurricane season!

You're so bad...

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote FluMom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2017 at 2:23pm
I agree Med. My biggest worry is NK and if that nutty fat kid sends a Nuke our way. I have plenty of KI but no shelter. I have been trying to figure out how to make a shelter using lead lined wall board but that is not thick enough to protect you need 4" thick lead bricks. You know how much that must weigh but that is better than having to dig out my backyard.

Since my son is not in town I really do not care if I survive I would only build one if he was going to live here after I die.

Guys that little fat guy could do a number on a lot of the U.S. if he chooses to do so. We had better make a section here on what we need to do.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2017 at 3:31pm
I could not agree with you more, FluMom.  Except for one point, you matter too.  

Apart from the fact that I like you, as we get older and our bodies get weaker, our knowledge grows, so we become more valuable for our minds as we become less so for our bodies.  Assuming your son came home after an attack as a survivor, how much could your knowledge help him?  

This is not an impossible senario: though blast does huge damage after a nuke, the fallout - though briefly deadly - has a half life of only about half an hour (assuming it did not land on chalk, limestone or gypsum), so things go from totally deadly - even to the immune cockroaches - to quite survivable within weeks.  If your shelter can survive blast, or escapes it, ANY mass will protect you if you have enough of it.  As a rule of thumb, the heavier it is the better it is.  If there is insufficient mass then distance is the best protection.  Staying indoors with plastic and duct tape as dust protection can make the difference.

A storm or root cellar is good, you would need planking and sandbags ready to cover any thin bits like the outside doors often found on them.

Failing that the gap under the stairs (stairs covered and surrounded by sandbags)  Works too.

If you have large water tanks you could fill then as they block radiation as well, and a pipe can do the heavy lifting for you.  Just stack them empty and fill them in situ.  A damp blanket will catch radioactive dust but allow air to travel through.  Pin it up with its bottom edge in a tank of water and it will keep itself wet by capiliary action.  You need to be protected from this by a massive wall or barrier and a turn or two but from that point on you do not then need to worry about dust.  (Dust floats around corners, radiation only travels in straight lines,)

If the big stuff is to hand, you have at worst half an hour to get ready for fallout, but you could get up to twelve hours if the wind conditions are right.  You might get even longer if ground zero is far enough away.  KJU is not going to have that many of the nukes he has only just acquired, so if he uses them he will pick his targets very carefully.  Think like him and you will be automatically in a safe zone (There will be more of those than there are dangerous ones)

Be safe my friend.  You matter!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote EdwinSm, Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2017 at 10:59pm
I mostly read here (almost every day), only occasionally posting.  Right now there is a holding pattern with almost no news of flu as the most likely candidate has taken a summer break.

It is a trailing indicator, but I do follow the CDC report on child mortality, and the past season has been about mid range in the number of deaths, so while these have been sad and tragic for the families, it has not been enough to get people worried about a flu pandemic (or even a bad season).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2017 at 9:13am
I visit AFT on a regular basis in order to inform my own work on national security and bioterrorism.   You all do a good job of surveillance!  I particularly enjoy the international perspective. 

This information was sent to me by an associate with the WMD Directorate of the FBI, it should give you some good reading: 


Infectious diseases wax and wane, as do the level of consciousness of the US public and government infrastructure.  Keep vigilant, stuff is always happening that you do not hear about. 

Be safe, Chuck 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2017 at 9:20am
Originally posted by Medclinician Medclinician wrote:



There is an outbreak in Burma right now of H1N1 and people are dying. It is nowhere on the mainstream at all. Ebola, dangerous new viruses and outbreaks still are happening all over the world, but government don't want their tourist trade hurt so they suppress reporting.


Here is more information on H1N1 "swine flu" in Nepal:

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2017 at 3:57pm
SOME DONT LIKE   IT , WHO CARES......

 "can we move general discussion  I had enough i dont like what pepople saying about CHUMP"


 CHUMP =LOSER 

winning of both houses of your government and doing

NOTHING....

cant pass a thing....why 

COZ HE AN IDIOT BUFF HEAD ,COMMIE LOVING,  NO SUBSTANCE, FOOL 

 in way over his small head........

oh by the way ,i posted about Myanmar h5n1 out break weeeks ago,

its not Burma anymore thats why you dont get reports on Burma



"The ruling military junta changed its name from Burma to Myanmar in 1989, a year after thousands were killed in the suppression of a popular uprising. Rangoon also becameYangon. The Adaptation of Expression Law also introduced English language names for other towns, some of which were not ethnically Burmese.Sep 26, 2007"

BBC News - Should it be Burma or Myanmar?

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7013943.stm

i also posted about the Greatest threat facing the Human population....antibiotic resistance....noone seems to realise what  a threat this is.....

12 monkeys!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2017 at 6:19pm
Deep breath, carbon. Med wasn't posting anything particularly political or contentious. 

I agree with you 110% about the threat of antibiotic resistance. We are facing a public health crisis of epic proportions, and nobody seems to be talking about it. Before antibiotics became readily available, deaths from sepsis were far more commonplace. We stepped out of that world for a while, and apparently long enough to become blind to the dangers of an untreated cut, scratch or sore throat. I can't begin to imagine a world without a cure a prescription away. The psychological effect it will have on those used to easy access to effective treatments will be devastating. Learn to treat things before they become systemic, because pandemic or not, it might just save your life or that of a loved one.


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"Any community that fails to prepare, with the expectation that the federal government will come to the rescue, will be tragically wrong." Michael Leavitt, HHS Secretary.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2017 at 6:54pm
Yes sorry bad week, Just venting....

antibiotic resistance =no more operations, c-sections,face lifts,tatoots,any injury could kill,even a rose bush scratch,

infections will = amputations

this is scary stuff.....
12 monkeys!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dutch Josh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2017 at 10:51pm
What I want from any forum in wich I participate first of all is being respected. I do not buy any insults...

What makes a forum interesting is difference of opinion. Why (intelligent) people come to very different conclusions-having the same sort of information I find interesting. 

(For instance https://robertscribbler.com/2017/08/01/new-study-finds-that-present-co2-levels-are-capable-of-melting-large-portions-of-east-and-west-antarctica/, https://www.facebook.com/paul.beckwith.9, and https://www.facebook.com/JoseBarbaNueva?fref=nf&pnref=story have 3 different views on climate change (RS: we may survive, there still is time, PB: population could be 500 million by 2050, Joe Neubarth claims we are "living dead")

A pandemic needs a background-most pandemics have to do with wars, climate changing, refugees etc. It is not only a story of virusses, bacteria, prions etc. (In my opion allergy is worth watching-on an increase https://www.aaaai.org/conditions-and-treatments/library/allergy-library/prevalence-of-allergies-and-asthma)

I admit that I put a lot of links to my posts-use this forum sometimes as a "parking space" for articles I want to read later on. 

In my opinion discussion on wars belong here as well-and I am against "militairy solutions", I do not believe in it. They are a waste of money causing suffering to millions in the interest of a few. At the end humans themselves are the major risk for their own survival. 

(You do not want to think of North Korea with 14 Fukushima's in a war zone-that is a global risk and totally unacceptable !)
Que sera, sera, Whatever will be, will be, The future is not ours to see, Que sera, sera !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jacksdad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 05 2017 at 11:48pm
Originally posted by carbon20 carbon20 wrote:

...antibiotic resistance =no more operations, c-sections,face lifts,tatoots,any injury could kill,even a rose bush scratch,

infections will = amputations

this is scary stuff.....


It is scary - and the more you contemplate it, the scarier it gets. We're going to look back at the golden age of antibiotics and kick ourselves for being so shortsighted and reckless.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Medclinician Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2017 at 5:42am
Originally posted by FluMom FluMom wrote:

I agree Med. My biggest worry is NK and if that nutty fat kid sends a Nuke our way. I have plenty of KI but no shelter. I have been trying to figure out how to make a shelter using lead lined wall board but that is not thick enough to protect you need 4" thick lead bricks. You know how much that must weigh but that is better than having to dig out my backyard.

Since my son is not in town I really do not care if I survive I would only build one if he was going to live here after I die.

Guys that little fat guy could do a number on a lot of the U.S. if he chooses to do so. We had better make a section here on what we need to do.


I agree with you in terms of NK is our biggest threat. Of all things, AFT is a place for preppers and I truly regret not finishing Pandemic Now. Most cities on the west coast, especially in Silicon Valley have no real response plan for a nuclear strike. While Russia has drills and consider this a valid scenario to try and survive, I think too many people say - well what can you do?

I had a very vivid dream once, after a nuclear attack I was on a high place watching terrorists go from house to house killing people. They reached one place which had people all firing automatic weapons and one of them pulled out a LAW - shoulder missile kind of and blew the place up and those inside with a rocket. And just moved on.

Humans are pretty resilient, maybe not as good as cockroaches which will probably still be around. The medical care system won't. I have talked to people at the very high levels for years and in terms of Flu or apocalyptic Pandemic, they won't do anything. Just go underground, use up the vaccines which have not been put out there so they will still be effective and some may stay underground for decades.

I realize that AFT one of the best places for discussing what many sites cannot manage to control with a wide variety of good people. Almost a family. I frequently post links to AFT on Facebook from my news page and other places and the fact Albert has been able to keep AFT alive and working versus government sites which have been hacked and shut down, is no small accomplishment.

Someone wants AFT to remain online in high places and reads it.

To sum up my whole take on the election, who won and who ran is that we did not have a candidate that was presidential. Our political office holders have become like fast food, or cars that break all the time, or pollution and corruption in every aspect of life. People are in office that are not qualified or capable of being there.  Race and gender have become a huge issue with people coming into office to represent minorities and not all of us - and advance their own agendas.

Around the world many nations have become matriarchal, with female Prime Ministers in U.K. as there were Queens (Elizabeth), Indira Ghandi in India.



California and New York become increasingly powerful so have the forces to put a female in as president to represent women's interests and shatter what was left of the glass ceiling. I cannot really say how I would have voted if they had picked the right woman or event the right black man or Latin American to run. The pedal to the metal test of any leader would be to have them in power during a World War.

One of the problems with keeping on track in here is that prepping is also hooked to political environment. There are safe places for Congress and the President and Vice-President and if it hits the fan, they will go there and we will be left out in disease, fallout landscape with no police, protection medical care, or infrastructure.

In my dire, doomsday manner which started in 1978 as I wrote the book Survivor, I have seen this as a reality and a "not if but when".

So, what is the world situation today if not some terrorist (well this is not really true) Kim Jong-un is a terrorist of sorts and also seriously crazy in terms of any reality as to the effect of sets off a nuke or attacking Seoul, if the worst happens? Personally I still think a bio-weapon attack would be highly doable and effective - especially if the leadership had a vaccine for it.

What will happen if a preemptive nuclear strike is carried on on North Korea? They will launch and kill 20 million people.  Already South Korea is not going to even try to do anything to save Seoul. They are more geared for a possible invasion of South Korea.

Russia and China are not our friends and they cannot be trusted as to what they will do if it happens. Russia continues to have a nuclear submarine presence as well as China. Either could decide to launch first given the survival numbers.

Meanwhile, to me the entire government except for maybe our intelligence agencies although James Comey - who everyone missed the fact was yet another lawyer - did not help the FBI - have done better than most of the leadership. Multiple attacks have been thwarted and the CIA is over in North Korea right now and I can't help but think there is a "Terminate with extreme prejudice" plot in place to remove Kim Jong-un.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terminate_with_extreme_prejudice

This would be a quick and nasty end to the current problem and Kim Jong-un knows it and already has claimed it has been tried.

This rapidly become  a Shakespearean drama. It is unlikely any tears would be shed or that any country would retaliate but it will not be done by Russia or China who don't like the U.S. on their doorstep and North Korea is a proxy pain in the butt which creates a buffer of anti-America activity at the nuclear level.

I have not failed to notice a basic attitude of "The Clown must die" in America. Waving severed heads in the air is perhaps not a too subtle reminder of the breeding children of Anarchy who would like to see everything in chaos.

Despite economic gains and some pluses I think more many people there is an overall depressive sigh of "This sucks". Somewhere during the election the "It just can't happen", happened.

The multiple candidates of the Republicans - especially Sanders who many people really supported and was euthanized by Hillary in illegal attacks - became a Circus.

So, on this dark and overcast Sunday morning I look at the world situation and feel the same sentiment.

This sucks.

We are on a collision course with the North Korea powder keg going off and we can't diffuse the bomb.  Negotiation does not work. It is ridiculous to put any serious thought into persuading Kim Jong-un from continuing the North Korean suicidal effort to launch a nuclear attack on the U.S. and we are at a point he can at least do it to South Korea and what will we do. Vaporize all the people in North Korea. There is no way to do a single surgical strike except with a regime change.

I often smile how simple descriptions are the most effective. That nutty fat kid. We see a condition where a dictator is in power and the French Revolution did not happen. Any would be enemy was taken out including family. Far more effective than the English kings who notoriously were snuffed by would be rulers. And we have a rather disturbing combination. Kim Jong-un is intelligent. There is no way he could have sustained his power or position without some intelligent moves.

That is why he holds a lot of cards in terms of attacking South Korea. He cannot be stopped from vaporizing Seoul.

Yet, I would say  - that will be - not if, but when.

Medclinician


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 06 2017 at 8:05am
My only argument with that, Med, is that it is sunny over here.
  .................................................................................Like all good things it is not expected to last.
Absence of proof is not proof of absence.
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