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PANDEMIC ALERT LEVEL
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Tracking the next pandemic: Avian Flu Talk

What really matters

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 2:24pm
I bet those who want to destroy this forum are very pleased with themselves. Tomorrow is another day and with the dawn comes a promise.

Edited by Fruitcake - April 19 2006 at 2:25pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 2:29pm
AlaskeAquarian: I just wanted to take the opportunity to thank your family for serving our country. I know your husband is Air Force, but you and your children serve as well. Thank you
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 2:39pm
oknut - you were 1 of 4 people who donated money to our cause of helping struggling families to prepare.   Out of 50,000 "visitors" per week that this site receives, or 3 million hits, I would say your intentions are quite unique.
 
Your request has been declined.
 
Smile 
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlaskaAquarian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 2:41pm
Stern Smile 

Edited by AlaskaAquarian - April 21 2006 at 8:26am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 2:46pm
That makes me happy. To tell you the truth today was a turning point in my miserable existence. I  got me a bread making machine, threw some stuff in it and glory be  .... I have what looks like a loaf of bread !.
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Clap Hurraaay for Fruit! I want some fresh bread!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ironstone Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 2:53pm
Those bread machines are wonderful.  I got some machine flour to use because i really don't expect us to go back to the caveman days.
 
Look people, opinions are like rear-ends...everybodys got one.  Lets agree to disagree and i'm quite sure both factions in this have others who agree with them.  We are here to get information and we should not toss that information because we diasgree with it or feel it not what we ahere to.
Ironstone
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlaskaAquarian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 2:56pm
Clap amen, Iron. I came to this board because I saw that so many felt the same way I did (and still do) And for info.  The topic "What really matters" appealed to me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scotty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 2:59pm
Nice light touch there Fruitcake. Well done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 3:15pm
Madam ... this bread is not only well done,  and light, but perfectly seductive !.  Oh Dear, maybe I am not allowed to say that here ... so I will not mention the equivalent of multiple orgasms .... with the crispy fresh crust ... absolutley oozing with wonderous odours .... and of course I cannot mention the decadent thick layer of fresh creamy butter ! .......
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlaskaAquarian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 3:19pm

Censored sounds divine



Edited by AlaskaAquarian - April 19 2006 at 3:20pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scotty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 3:21pm
Where did I put that flour?

Did I mention that the daffodils are out now?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote outsidethecamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 3:47pm
Oknut...

If this is what you choose to  do, you're going to be the one who loses.  There will always be people out there who pi$$ us off.  I'm sure, w/my ultra non-"religious" conserviative beliefs, I've Pi$$ed off many.  Thank God,  NOBODY ever attacked me.  I'm a wimp, I probably would have folded too.

Don't go.  We need you & more importantly, you need us.

We're all in a world of hurt here & scared to death.  God forbid that we act this way post pandemic.  We're all going to need ea. other then more than ever.

I say once again...

God help us all!
Peggy

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oknut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 4:21pm
I'm not leaving because someone doesn't share my views.

Actually, I have several reasons for leaving and some have nothing to do with my views of some individuals who instigate prejudice and hate on the forum.

I am fine now - I am self employed, educated and own a home. I do donate what I can to people I feel need help.

Many, especially in America, have never been poor, homeless or hungry and completely lack empathy for those who feel without options. I have been poor, homeless and hungry in my life. I prefer to never be there again, but I don't judge those experiencing hard times to be stupid or without value.

I'm not totally naive and realize that there are bad people in the world, but most people will rise if given encouragement, kindness and opportunity.

While I like to think I'm fairly tolerant, there are a few things that really push my buttons and I'd rather walk away than debate them with virtual strangers.

One is child abuse and the other is the superiority complex that too many people adopt, thinking they appear more important than they are.   

Secretly, I think it's based more on inferiority complexes than actual delusions of being superior to others.

I have gained an enormous amount of information from this forum and have a great deal of respect for many of the people I've crossed paths with.

And yes, AlaskaAquarian - you are correct in stating that you did not Personally attack anyone. It was quite impersonal. You attacked only the poor and desperate people who no doubt cannot afford a computer or internet service.

People need information and encouragement.
Trust me, most will surprise you if they receive kindness and are not treated like someones' garbage.

I've recently seen people called trolls in public posts for no apparent reason. If someone takes the time to use the Search function, you can view prior posts made by members.

Some people appear to seek out opportunities to attack and ridicule. I didn't that that was tolerated here.

Like everyone here, I have a great deal to do. Work, home, family, friends and the endless preps.

I'm not tucking tail, I'm just moving on.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ironstone Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 4:30pm
Oknut, I will miss your posts and the information you contributed.  I hope after a cool-down period you will return.
Ironstone
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 4:48pm
OKnut,  Please stick around.  You have been a valued contributor.  Unfortunately, this is what happens when threads go on too long, and things get personal.  Please stick around and see this through.  Just ignore the personal  barbs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlaskaAquarian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 5:42pm

 



Edited by AlaskaAquarian - April 19 2006 at 11:06pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scotty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 6:28pm
I hope that the two of you will sleep on this. There are precious few of us as it is and in my view the forum will be diminished by the loss of either of you.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Proudest Monkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 9:45pm

oknut,

Please do not leave the forum. I have really enjoyed reading your posts, and I am not just saying that. We need you here to help keep things balanced. Please just think about it before you decide to leave for good.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jefiner Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 19 2006 at 10:01pm
ummm . . .
 
oknut, don't leave . . . don't even move on.  Stick around.  You are needed.
 
AA, you are needed, too; ya just got to turn the volume down a little.  I think all that midnight sun is getting to you, with the blue font and all. 
 
Not everyone buys into every theory that is put out there, but I sure don't need it beat into my head over and over and over.
 
nuff said.  Chill, pickles.
Jefiner



Either you had no purpose

Or the purpose is beyond the end you figured

And is altered in fulfilment.    T. S. Eliot   
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..



Edited by AlaskaAquarian - April 21 2006 at 8:27am
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law and order will break down like Katrina.
 
People will go on the rampage for food and anything else they can get their hands on.
 
The police will be too busy, too sick or too scared to do anything at all so the criminal element will have no checks or anything to stop them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gravitation Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 2:45am
Kilt, get a grip, you are imagining it all. It's from the movies.Get a dvd out, buy a movie ticket. Take a breath. realise what you predict aint real.

Did I miss it all? oknut stay and partake.
AA get off oknut's back.
Me? I'm cool
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 8:18am
Originally posted by Gravitation Gravitation wrote:

AA get off oknut's back. 
 
It would be appropriate to read the whole thread before issuing advice/demands.
 
AA has told nothing but the truth. Some here are selective in their reading and comprehension. She is only defending herself from those trying to besmirch her character. She has done a fine job on her own and does not need my help, but I will not stand by and let someone 'spin' and accuse falsely.
 
Many here love to accuse, and probably justifiably, the government of not telling the whole truth. But yet when one of our members present facts, then all Hades breaks loose. Can't have it both ways...
 
We are all here to learn, educate and opine about the BF. Let's do so without the ad hominems!
 
Now back to your regular programming...
 
Survival does have an 'I'!

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Grav don't start. The horse is dead, no sense beating it anymore. So, get off my back.

Edited by AlaskaAquarian - April 20 2006 at 8:47am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 8:49am
oknut, Please stay, you are valuable to us all. If and when this happens it won't be just the "poor" who will panic, it will be the more well to do who have not prepped  that will add themselves to the mob. Some people, and they should think themselves lucky, have never had hard times and don't know what it is to have to struggle. They will never understand unless they  have to go thru it. Please stay, but if you don't, I will keep you in my prayers always. Peace.
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[QUOTE=AlaskaAquarian]You know what sticks out in my mind? When humans become desperate, desperate measures are usually taken.
I would advise everyone to watch any documented riot. Mob mentality will rule when survival is threatened. No one is going to see a helpless child on their door step, they are going to see mobs with sticks, knives and guns who will be trying to take what you have so that they can survive. Altho I personally talk to everyone about prepping, I do not tell anyone outside of my immediate family what I have got stored. This is common sense as the less people know that you have supplies, the less you will have to defend those supplies. I believe that if we have told everyone that we know the facts on H5N1, as we know them and encourage them to prepare, that we have satisfied the requirements of an intelligent society. That being said, Not all in an intelligent society are ACTUALLY intelligent. If people don't prepare (and trust me I have been crying the news for some time, and some of the folks I've discussed BF with "can't afford to put a little extra by", but they can go out and spend a couple hundred on a new car stereo)
then am I going to be the one to "save" them? No, I will be lucky if I can do for my own by the time TSHTF. And I will defend myself and family from ANYONE who assumes that they can take from me because they don't have. This forum is about survival, I plan to survive.


Edited by jo007athome - April 20 2006 at 9:19am
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Edited by Gravitation - April 20 2006 at 9:40am
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jo, which has been my point all along.  I'd like to believe the general population will be calm and will treat everyone else with dignity.....I don't think this is how it's going to go. IMO, there will be panic. There will be those that chose to ignore the warnings, they'll be making mad dashes to the stores. They'll fight over the last supplies.
I know this why?
Just look at CHRISTMAS time , black Friday is a great example. During the season when people should be happy and celebrating the birth of our Lord, they're fighting over the last portable dvd player. The last "hit" game. Now, we'd all like to believe that humans will rise up and help others. I sincerely hope this is the case rather than the other alternative.
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LOL



Edited by AlaskaAquarian - April 20 2006 at 1:20pm
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Originally posted by jo007athome jo007athome wrote:

Mob mentality will rule when survival is threatened. No one is going to see a helpless child on their door step, they are going to see mobs with sticks, knives and guns who will be trying to take what you have so that they can survive.

It seems to me that anyone who wanted to survive and avoid catching the flu would avoid congregating with others who may already have the flu - be they fellow mob members or potential robbery victims. Don't forget that someone with the flu may not yet be showing symptoms.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlaskaAquarian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 9:46am
Irene, VERY good point. Would the fear of BF be enough to keep people in their homes , and not scavange for supplies? Would they go to their neighbors'? I don't think I'm going to ever watch the movie 'The Stand' again or at least look at it the same way.
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Originally posted by AlaskaAquarian AlaskaAquarian wrote:

I don't agree with turning helpless children away, however... men and women that did not prepare for themselves will not be welcomed.  I'm not running a charity house for those who chose not to prepare. I'd have to agree with you Komet.

I do what I can to help others in this world. But when a pandemic breaks out, I will not put my family at risk. Especially for those who chose to not heed warnings issued by local and federal officials.

It's a noble thing to not turn helpless children away Alaska, I applaud you for that. But how many helpless children can you afford to take in? 1, 2, 5, 10, 20 or maybe even 30 or more kids? I think that once word gets around that you have a kind heart, you'll have a lot of helpless kids at your doorstep. What then do you tell you own kids about generosity when you're out of tuna fish and their little stomachs starts rumbling? Not trying to be hard here............just realistic.
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I really don't know. I've not been in that situation. I don't know what will happen. I hope I don't have to take in so many children.  I'm going to prepare for my family, and add a bit of extra. Who knows. I might be able to help more than one child.  It'd break my heart to have to turn children away.... what if it were my kids that needed help? And every neighbor's house they went to, the door would be slammed in their little faces out of fear of BF? It is a thought that haunts me at night and makes me pray daily.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 2ifbyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 12:56pm
Originally posted by retiredcopper retiredcopper wrote:

I think that once word gets around that you have a kind heart, you'll have a lot of helpless kids at your doorstep.
 
At that point I beleive that our Creator is trying to tell us something. Religion and spirituality hasn't really been much of a part of this topic. There have been many posts as to our morals and moralilty in certain scenerios. But no one I've read has written about God in our lives. I do not care what religion you  practice, nor even if you have one, it should be a matter of faith that good will overcome evil.
 
Humans are capable of unimaginable feats, both good and bad. It's our duty as a species to ensure that we do not let our fears and prejudices overcome our ability to discern the difference twix right and wrong.
 
I've been taught that we are never given life challenges beyond our means, including death. So I would trust that if the kids start lining up for assistance, I will do what I can to aid them. I would try to insulate and protect my family but I could not turn a child away.


Edited by 2ifbyC - April 20 2006 at 1:52pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GrizzlyGirl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 2:18pm
Originally posted by Fruitcake Fruitcake wrote:

I bet those who want to destroy this forum are very pleased with themselves. Tomorrow is another day and with the dawn comes a promise.
 
Oknut~
Don't give up on the forum. Sometimes, people tend to get emotionally charged when they speak of something that they feel so strongly about. I am not endorsing anything in this thread, yet I am not persecuting either. People are entitled to their own opinions at any time. Deciding when and when NOT to share their opinions with others is an entirely different matter and often times people do not think of the consequences of what they are saying will have on others (my hubby is like this sometimes). Although these people are good hearted and valued members of society (we hope) they tend to speak out on matters that they feel strongly about without considering the impact their words may have on others.  Keep your chin up and don't let this conversation disgust you, just remeber that this is America and everyone believes that they are entitled to their opinion. Whether or not we are entitled to it is entirely a different story. Please don't go!
Live Well, Laugh Often, Love Much!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GrizzlyGirl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 3:14pm
Originally posted by retiredcopper retiredcopper wrote:

Originally posted by AlaskaAquarian AlaskaAquarian wrote:

I don't agree with turning helpless children away, however... men and women that did not prepare for themselves will not be welcomed.  I'm not running a charity house for those who chose not to prepare. I'd have to agree with you Komet.

I do what I can to help others in this world. But when a pandemic breaks out, I will not put my family at risk. Especially for those who chose to not heed warnings issued by local and federal officials.

It's a noble thing to not turn helpless children away Alaska, I applaud you for that. But how many helpless children can you afford to take in? 1, 2, 5, 10, 20 or maybe even 30 or more kids? I think that once word gets around that you have a kind heart, you'll have a lot of helpless kids at your doorstep. What then do you tell you own kids about generosity when you're out of tuna fish and their little stomachs starts rumbling? Not trying to be hard here............just realistic.
 
Good Point! I think that although more people should be prepping and they aren't, in times of pandemic, I would inmagine that many parents will send their children off to be taken in by neighbors or friends that prepped better and can provide their children with better care in a pandemic than they can. Parents will always do what they feel is in the best interest of their children (hopefully) first and foremost. If that means sending them to solicit care from a neighbor or friend, then that is what they will do to ensure a  higher level of safety and security as well as food for their kids. I think the parents will be far more concerned about their children being taken care of than they themselves being taken care of. If sending their kids to soemone else to be fed and taken in is what they need to do to protect their kids then that is what most will do.
Another key point about "keeping kids stimulated abd busy" if TSHTF, maybe it will be better for some families to ban together for the sake of their kids. Compiling rations and preps and joining two families together (especially if each family only has one child) may be very helpful in keeping their kids safely indoors. Having as playmate in times like this will also keep the kids occupied and keep their mind away from running and frolicing outdoors.
Any thoughts?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GrizzlyGirl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 3:26pm
Originally posted by AlaskaAquarian AlaskaAquarian wrote:

I really don't know. I've not been in that situation. I don't know what will happen. I hope I don't have to take in so many children.  I'm going to prepare for my family, and add a bit of extra. Who knows. I might be able to help more than one child.  It'd break my heart to have to turn children away.... what if it were my kids that needed help? And every neighbor's house they went to, the door would be slammed in their little faces out of fear of BF? It is a thought that haunts me at night and makes me pray daily.
 
It sounds like maybe there is a solution to this dilemma. Find at least one friend or neighbor who lives close to you. In the event that TSHTF, set up a plan for your children to implement in the event that the worst happens and their parents are no longer around. Every parent should plan for the worst and hope for the best, but in the event that the worst happens, the surviving kids should feel safe and secure in knowing that their neighbor (or friend) can be relied on to take the kids in and keep them from harm. I don't know exactly the best way to set a plan like this in motion because I myself do not have children living at home, but if I did, I would make darn certain that BEFORE the SHTF, I had a plan in place to send my kids to a friend or to take in that friends' kids for care. I think it is a great idea to find the one neighbor that you trust more than the rest and establish a pact to look after each others' children in a "worst-case scenario". I know that should either of my sisters' and their husbands perish, or even my dearest friend and her husband,  I would be in my car in a split second to go retrieve the kids and bring them in to my care.  After all, these children will one day grow up and may even comeinto a similar situation in their life. I would like to think that they learned valuable lessons about humanity from the experiences they have been through as well as the learn by example mentality.
Live Well, Laugh Often, Love Much!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scotty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 4:49pm
GrizzlyGirl: In a tortuous and irrational thread your comments make good sense. Do make sure that you keep a written record of any agreements.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Edrn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 9:53pm
Nukedeja vu cold war i bomb shelters my usualy very gentle father telling me would close door on freinds & neighbors and let them die. Still have nightmares that & missles.
 
My solution?  Share until looks like threat to family, then kill 'em all.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
"We are but weasels fighting in a hole"
                                                           -  W.B. Yeats
alia atreides
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Edrn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 9:54pm
maybe everybody _will_ nuke each other and then nobody will have to worry about  it Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Edrn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2006 at 10:10pm
ummm>>> apologize for negativity of posts today  (except Yeats quote).  Was sorry to hear some of tone of earlier posts on this forum... Does anybody esle remember Twilight zone episode "The Monsters Are Due on Maple  Street'  ?  Is this where we are headed already?
   And flu isn't even here yet.
Please, no- titled to own opinions, 1st amendment all that but take all the dissing , hurting each other else somewhere else please .  Life sometimes sucks enough without that.  Unhappy 
  Will skip any sarcastic suggestions of chat rooms to go to for that (but initials are ICQ)
 
 
 
and please, children, I don't want to feel like quoting A.C. Swinburne anymore
(don't ask )
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scotty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2006 at 9:03am
Always wanted to know how to spell that. And the other one as well. C'est la what's its name. Thanks Edrn.

Just popped back to see if this thread is still festering. Purses at ten paces. It's perfectly acceptable to agree to differ you know?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AlaskaAquarian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2006 at 9:09am
I was going to post something (other than what I'm posting now), but I'd probably get attacked for that too! So.... I'm done with discussions. I'll stick to reading.

Edited by AlaskaAquarian - April 21 2006 at 9:10am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Acesh Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2006 at 9:38am
Edrn
Are you so sure that H5N1 is it's not here yet?  I'm not!! 
So it just hoped over to the Wild Bird population?  When, 2005?
What was it doing in 2004 & 2003? 
 
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