Tracking the next pandemic: Avian Flu Talk |
MEDICAL ISSUES |
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Posted: January 29 2006 at 4:32pm |
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Important information about medical issues. Prescription medications. Helpful OTC medications. First Aid information.
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swankyc
V.I.P. Member Joined: January 11 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 314 |
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I have an asthmatic wife and son that eed certain meds DAILY. Priority one is a workable nebulizer, which means electricity - generator with lots of gas. A nebulizer, or the darth vader as I call it, is a small air machine with a breathing mask or tube that atomizes albuterol (steroid) and other goodies so that the asthmatic can breathe it in. Other items in the never ending line of medicines: Inhalers, Albuterol for the nebulizer, Flovent, Advair, Singulair. My son is prone to ear infections, which SEVERELY affects his asthma. Luckily, my wife is Mexican with a family in San Deigo. We got several courses of antibiotic Amoxicillan (over the counter without prescription) to fight his ear infections. She is going for a visit in Feb and will be looking around to see if she can get heavy duty flu meds. We've already looked for Tamiflu there - no dice.
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I'm not afraid, I'm paranoid. Dont talk too loud, they are listening.
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Originally posted by SZ: I am not recommending this to anyone but this is why I have Curcumin in my Pandemic Flu Stash. As we all should know by now H5N1 appears to produce a "Cytokine Storm". In my language that means the body turns on its immune system balls-to-the-wall and ends up literally killing what it is trying to save. I am going to post a PubMed description of a cytokine storm. Stay with me because the particulars (the bits) are important.
[Cytokine storm in the pathogenesis of multiple organ dysfunction syndrome associated with surgical insults] [Article in Japanese] Aikawa N. Department of Emergency and Critical Care Medicine, School of Medicine, Keio University, Tokyo, Japan. Multiple organ dysfunction syndrome (MODS) is a critical condition developing in the patients under overwhelming surgical insults such as a major surgery, severe trauma, extensive burn, and systemic sepsis. The host response to those surgical insults is the main pathogenetic factor contributing to the development of shock and MODS seen in surgical patients. The proinflammatory cytokines, TNF-alpha (TNF) and interleukin-1 beta (IL-1), are known to play a pivotal role in the pathogenetic mechanisms of MODS. In response to surgical insults, macrophages produce and release TNF and IL-1 which subsequently induce the production of other cytokines (IL-6, IL-8, etc.) and other endogenous chemical mediators (growth factors, adhesion molecules, complement cleavage products, thrombin, eicosanoids, PAF, nitric oxides, oxygen-free radicals, granulocyte elastase, etc.) The resultant systemic inflammation may develop into shock and MODS when the primary insults are overwhelming (early MODS) or a second inflammatory insult such as sepsis triggers an exaggerated inflammation. In the patients suffering from MODS, a systemic release of various cytokines is not properly regulated, and the high blood levels of the proinflammatory cytokines induce an autodestructive generalized inflammatory reaction. This condition is termed "Cytokine Storm" by the author. In the cytokine storm, not only proinflammatory cytokines but also anti-inflammatory cytokines are elevated in the blood stream. With the recent understanding of the biological and pathological roles of cytokines and other mediators, a new therapeutic strategy has been developed. In addition to the reduction of the surgical insults, a variety of anti-cytokine therapy and anti-mediator therapy has been tested in an attempt to prevent or treat the life-threatening MODS. Publication Types: PMID: 8940690 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Now for the benefits of Curcumin: https://enzy.com/abstracts/display.asp?id=1961
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Originally posted by floridian: Came across some research that shows that vitamin E reduces the amount of virus in the lungs of animals infected with influenza A and B, and reduces TNF and IL-1, two chemicals associated with the 'cytokine storm.' |
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Originally posted by KillerFlu.net: Black Elderberry: (Sambucol) A study in
clinical trial in Israel showed that a preparation not only ended cases of the flu within three days, but increased antibody production. (I believe all these studies have been conducted on Natures Way Sambucol) The effect of Sambucol, a black elderberry-based, natural product, on the production of human cytokines: I. Inflammatory cytokines. RESEARCH A variety of research data from studies conducted around the world have proven Sambucol® to be effective in shortening the duration of the flu and lessening flu symptoms. Below are some research highlights: Effect of Sambucol® on several strains of Influenza virus Sambucol®, a standardized extract, is a preparation based on the berries of the black elder, used as herbal remedy for influenza virus infections. It contains a potent antiviral compound, AntiVirin® as well as a high amount of three flavonoids (Bronnum-Hansen and Hansen, 1983). The flavonoids are naturally occurring plant antioxidants. Laboratory Tests Sambucol® reduced hemagglutination and inhibited replication of human influenza virus type A, type B and animal strains from swine and turkeys in cell cultures. Clinical Study A double-blind placebo-controlled clinical study was conducted during an outbreak of influenza B Panama. A significant improvement of the symptoms, including fever, was seen in 93.3% of the cases in Sambucol® treated group within 2 days. A complete cure was achieved within 2 to 3 days in nearly 90% of the Sambucol® treated group and within at least 6 days in the placebo group. "Inhibition of Several Strains of Influenza Virus in Vitro and Reduction of Symptoms by an Elderberry Extract (Sambucus nigra L) during an Outbreak of Influenza B Panama", Z. Zakay-Rones et al. J. Alt Compl Med 1:361-369;1995. other studies also, but lost the info.
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Originally posted by SZ: These are what I brought in...assume generic if one was available Electrolyte replacer(s) Aspirin, Tylenol, Advil, Alive - I have bottles of each as each has there best usages. Benadryl - unexpected minor allergic reactions Antidiarrheal - self explanatory NyQuil & DayQuil - allows patient restful sleep Cough syrup Maalox - For sour stomach & also suggested as a salve for extreme irritation from diarrhea, neutralizes acidity, etc. Ensure - liquid diet for ill patient who can't manage/want solids. Sinus medication PROPHYLACTIC SUPPLIMENTS - assume 1 years supply per person. Vitamins: A, B-COMPLEX, C, Calcium w/D, E, ZINC. I chose individuals as opposed to a multi vitamin because this way I can tailor the dosage in shifting circumstances. Supplements: Fish Oil, Curcumin (anti-inflammatories); Co-Q10, Cranberry extract; Green Tea Extract; Resveratrol; N-Acetyl Cysteine (NAC has been shown to have anti-inflammatory properties in lungs, as has Resveratrol) Of the above, I have copious amounts (read: higher than normal dosage planned) of C, E, Fish Oil, Green Tea, Co-Q10. For the vitamins & supplements I bought the best quality I could find from a supplier that guarantees standardized doses. www.lef.org (just who I trust, I have no affiliation beyond standard membership with this website/organization). Off-brand & discount vitamins & supplements are notorious for not having the % listed on the label, some have been found to contain NONE of the active ingredient(s). I did not buy these all at once...it represents a huge investment and only what I determined met my needs. YMMV.
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Originally posted by Mary Kay: Inserting a nasogastric tube: |
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Originally posted by bruss01: In the list of medications (I may have missed it) I did not see any expectorant for helping move congested mucus out of the lungs. It's probably contained in some of the multi-ingredient concoctions like NyQuil, but it can be bought as a stand-alone med also. I prefer stand-alone varieties for the most part, because it helps me be more flexible with the dosages of each individual ingredient. I bought two big bottles of generic guaifenesin (400mg) tablets at Costco. It's an expectorant, I believe the same ingredient as in the OTC "Mucinex". It helps thin and loosen congestion so it can be coughed up more easily, help keep things clear. Plus I imagine stagnant mucus would quickly become a breeding ground for secondary infections, as well as clogging otherwise-useful alveoli in the lungs. That's why I thought having some on hand might be a wise investment. Rather than buy and store something like "Pedialyte" electrolyte replenisher, we simply got cans of powdered Gatorade. It'll keep well, we only have to mix it on demand, and darn it, I enjoy the taste. Any drawbacks to this approach that anyone is aware of? |
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Originally posted by Fla_Medic: An ambu-bag (don't leave home without out one), can be used to assist ventilation. I've kept one in my personal first aid kit for 25 years, and it has come in handy. |
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willow41
Valued Member Joined: January 27 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 109 |
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I have looked all over for Feverall (tylenol) suppositories. During the flu when people are throwing up they can't keep fever meds down. Since we don't know how severe the symptoms will be when this turns H2H we need to be prepared. I finally found a pharmacy that sells the adult and junior strength sizes. www.westburypharmacy.com they also sell childrens and infants sizes. the adults dosage costs $46.99, but contains 50 suppositories
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Flubird
V.I.P. Member Joined: January 02 2006 Status: Offline Points: 43 |
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Think forward to what medical exam procedures you might need, or want, as routine or prospective diagnostic proceducres such as colonoscopies, EKGs, or many other forms of examinations one never really considers may not be available, who knows, for a couple, or several years, are hard to find.
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willow41
Valued Member Joined: January 27 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 109 |
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I have ordered first aid kits- an advanced suture/syringe kit include an i.v, burn kits, and dental kits. I also bought a huge first aid kit at Sam's Club. total cost for all $130. the kits that I ordered are Adventure Medical Kits, you can do a search and find their website. includes detailed info on the kits and links to websites that sell them. they all come with instruction books. in a pandemic you don't and probably won't be able to go to the dentist for a filling that fell out, or to the emergency room to get stiches etc.etc.
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Enumclaw,WA
Adviser Group Joined: January 31 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 67 |
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Be careful of Black Elderberry, My opinion.
My family won't be using it!!!! Black Elderberry Trade name: Sambucol (cached) &nbs p; history There is evidence that black elderberry extract (trade name: Sambucol) can reduce the risk of contracting ordinary influenza strains, or shorten the course of disease in those who contract the typical flu. It does so by increasing the production of inflammatory cytokines like IL-1, IL-6, and TNF. PMID:12455180 (cache). PMID:11399518 While black elderberry extract be appropriate for ordinary Type A influenza, it could make avian flu more lethal. Ordinary strains of flu do not trigger massive production of TNF, and ordinary flu viruses are generally susceptible to the action of TNF. Avian flu, by contrast, does trigger massive production of TNF (as much as a 45x increase), while the virus is relatively resistant to the anti-viral effects of TNF. If TNF is a significant cause of the illness and mortality in avian flu, anything that increases TNF would be undesirable. It has been pointed out that black elderberry does not just increase TNF and other cytokines. It also may reduce the spread of the virus through inactivation, or exert anti-inflammatory effects as well as contributing to the cytokine storm. It may be that combining elberberry with other anti-inflammatories may allow it to check the infection without producing tissue destroying levels of cytokines. But there is insufficient evidence to make a solid conclusion, while there are significant red flags that should be raised about the mode of action of elderberry. Edited by Enumclaw,WA |
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RB
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nomadcrna
Valued Member Joined: March 19 2006 Status: Offline Points: 1 |
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Unless you are able to intubate, it will be next to impossible to ventilate a
patient for long periods of time by simple mask. Masking (effective masking) is not an easy skill. Even for someone who does it every day there is a limit to how long you are able to mask a patient without fatigue setting in. Another thing you have to consider it it is doubtful you will have oxygen so will be using room air. While masking it good for an emergency airway, in a patient with severe enough lung problems to require ventilation, you need much more than someone masking them. Ron |
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calendula
Valued Member Joined: February 18 2006 Status: Offline Points: 345 |
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Welcome Nomadcrna! Looking forward to your posts and opinions. Let us know if you have any questions.
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I am not here to reason, I am here to create"
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asatrape
Valued Member Joined: March 16 2006 Status: Offline Points: 110 |
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Three members of my household have prescription meds that they have to
have on hand. The drs. and pharmacies are not very helpful in
assisting us with stockpiling what we may need if we are housebound for
more than several months. So I have gone to some overseas
pharmacies, shelled out the $$ and ordered what I needed. The DEA
hasn't come knocking on my door yet, but I thought it was worth the
risk.
I found many, many "no 'scripts" needed websites, but the cheapest were overseas. Me bad...... but ready! |
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Mississipp Mama
Valued Member Joined: January 20 2006 Status: Offline Points: 524 |
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Hi Asatrape, I am in the same situation wil you do me a favor and PM me the pharamacies you used over seas. Had you used them before? If you don't mind me asking how many months are you stock piling for? I would like to get a general idea of what to plan for. Thanks a lot.
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JaxMax
Adviser Group Joined: March 01 2006 Status: Offline Points: 801 |
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Webmaster- Consider moving the "PDF of Coming Pandemic" by mondegreen on the Avian Inflenza Discussion site to the permanent site here. Dr. Grattan Woodson's article is THE preeminent source for bird flu health care. Jax Max |
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He who walks with the wise grows wise, but a companion of fools suffers harm.Proverbs 13:20, The Bible
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Mrs. T
V.I.P. Member Joined: May 02 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 95 |
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My family's doctors will not give us the scripts to stock up on our meds.
I checked out our city's pandemic plan online and it states that people should have a supply of their prescription drugs on hand. I printed it and am taking it to my clinic.
I also am going to print the one from our state and the fed gov.
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Hi,
I transferred my prescriptions to drugstore.com. It saved $$ and the 30 day supply with 11 refills was automatically converted by drugstore to 90 days with 3 refills. They are very reputable and in the US so you don't have to worry about getting look-alike sugar pills.
K.
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bajmom
Valued Member Joined: June 13 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5 |
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I saw somewhere on here a recipe for make your own electrolyte mix. It called for "salt substitute" What is this and where can I find it??
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Bajmom,
Take a look at:
1/2 strength Gatoraid for adults
Pediasure for kids
Pedialyte for young kids
Your home-made brew can go bad etc. Stick with the main-stream.
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ImmuneConcerned
Adviser Group Joined: May 28 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 121 |
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I purchased electrolytes to mix with water in a small little kit convient for hikers. (My kids sometimes feel/are dehydrated even after drinking adequate amounts of gatoraid.) Purchased it over the net at some site advertising it for sports. The homemade electrolyte mix someone was talking about I am pretty sure consisted of salt & sugar added to water. I don't remember the percentagess. But at least one day I remember shopping for extra salt, sugar and basting tubes just in case I had to force liquids down some really sick person.
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ImmuneConcerned
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Dreamer
Valued Member Joined: March 11 2007 Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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I recently posted a piece on my blog about the use of home made ventilators during the polio epidemic of the late 1940s and early 1950s. Here is the link
Home Made Polio Epidemic Ventilators The need for ventilators was greater than the supply, and it appeared that many people especially children would die as a result. Some of the original inventors and developers of ventilators including Drinker, produced designs for ventilators that could be built from easily obtainable components and constructed by craftsmen. These home built ventilators were used to save the lives of people who could not obtain a commercial ventilator to use in this emergency. There are pictures and assembly drawings of these ventilators. The Pandemic Ventilator Project www.panvent.blogspot.com |
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