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Online Discussion: Tracking new emerging diseases and the next pandemic since 2005; Coronavirus COVID-19 Pandemic Discussion Forum.

Italy 16 cases one day!

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KiminNM View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiminNM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 29 2020 at 8:47am

Content of Pixie's last link:

At a press conference on Saturday, health authorities stated the number of overall cases had risen to 888.

That number includes 46 people who had been infected but are now fully recovered.

READ MORE: Coronavirus - The everyday precautions to take if you're in Italy

Only around half of that number are clinical cases, explained Angelo Borrelli, head of Italy's civil protection department.

The non-clinical cases have few or no symptoms, and are not in hospital but in isolation at home.

Some 64 of the patients are in intensive care.

Authorities confirmed total of 21 deaths across the country since the coronavirus outbreak began little over a week ago.

Those who have died are all Italian citizens, and the majority of the fatalities were in the northern region of Lombardy, which is the centre of the recent outbreak.

Most of the victims who have died were elderly, many over the age of 80. Some of them had underlying health conditions including cancer and were already in hospital when the virus was detected.

Italy has seen a huge surge in the number of cases since last Friday, when only three were reported.

Italy now has the highest number of people with the virus in Europe, and the highest death toll.

It has also been a point of contagion with many cases in other countries involving people who returned home after travelling in infection-hit areas of northern Italy.

READ ALSO: 

Italian authorities have urged calm whilst taking action, sometimes draconian, to halt the spread of the virus.

Prime Minister Giuseppe Conte urged people "not to give in to panic and follow the advice of health authorities".

Since Saturday, more than 50,000 people have been confined to 10 towns in Lombardy and one in Veneto - a drastic measure taken to halt the spread of the disease.

Italian government ministers have stressed that Italy remains safe to visit, as most of the country remains unaffected by the virus.

The number of cases of infection reported has risen steadily each day, though Italian researchers said on Friday that did not mean the virus was spreading. Most cases are believed to be people who had caught it previously, but had not been tested until now. According to the World Health Organisation 80 percent of those who are infected with the virus only suffer mild symptoms such as a headache or soar throat

Around five percent end up in a critical condition.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FluMom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 29 2020 at 8:59am

Oh yea, like I am going to travel now that this virus is loose...LOL try to save tourism and the money coming in...LOL!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote purereason Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 29 2020 at 9:19am

Then within hours they release today's numbers of 239 cases and 8 deaths

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 01 2020 at 10:18am

death toll from an outbreak of coronavirus in Italy has risen by five to 34 over the past 24 hours, the Civil Protection Agency said on Sunday, with the accumulative number of cases totaling some 1,694.


The head of the agency said that of those infected, 83 people had recovered. The contagion came to light 10 days ago and is focused on a handful of hotspots in the north of Italy with isolated cases reported in many other regions.



https://m.jpost.com/Breaking-News/Italys-coronavirus-death-toll-hits-34-nearly-1700-confirmed-cases-619412

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nc_girl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 01 2020 at 10:20am

Interexting!  I just saw on agenda-free tv that the number reported by bmp was 566.  Will need to investigate

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 02 2020 at 11:28am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 04 2020 at 9:46am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 06 2020 at 11:20am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiminNM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 06 2020 at 11:36am

Originally posted by Pixie Pixie wrote:

https://www.euronews.com/2020/03/05/two-more-people-die-from-covid-19-in-france-says-the-country-s-health-ministry


48 deaths overnite ,90 in past 48 hrs

Completely sobering when you put it like that. We're definitely in The Bad Place.  (shout out to any other fans of The Good Place) 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 06 2020 at 11:47am

Go Michael go!  'And back to the warehouse with you Janet.

ERCD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 6:57am

Had Euronews on earlier and they said the fatality rate in Italy is  4  1/2 %. Haven't been able to substantiate it yet. That is wildly high.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 11:38am

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/0307/1120848-italy-coronavirus-death-toll/

36 new deaths,total 233

Single day cases of 1,247

Intensive care from 462 to 567

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 12:07pm

Have Euronews on background here,they keep repeating that Italy has highest fatality rate 4 1/4%

If their numbers are accurate that figure is very,very bad.

Haven't been able to find link though.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 1:00pm

Italy moves forward with large lockdown. As bad as China seemed,maybe it was the only way to slow this down. 

https://www.reuters.com/article/health-coronavirus-italy-measures/italy-to-adopt-new-draconian-steps-to-fight-coronavirus-draft-decree-idUSR1N2A900M?rpc=401&

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 4:45pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pheasant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 4:55pm

Sigh....not good

my heart goes out to our brothers and sisters.....bad situation

The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself......FDR
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hazelpad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 6:27pm

Letter from Italian professors and doctors to European doctors warning them to GET READY.  Letter in the Independent and link to full article given below.

Italian doctors have warned medics across Europe to “get ready” for coronavirus in a letter revealing up to 10 per cent of all those infected with coronavirus need intensive care, with hospitals becoming overwhelmed.

The letter, seen by The Independent, reveals the scale of the impact on hospitals in Italy where 5,883 patients have been infected with the virus and 233 people have died as of 6pm on Saturday.

In the note, sent to the European Society of Intensive Care Medicine, critical care experts Professor Maurizio Cecconi, Professor Antonio Pesenti and Professor Giacomo Grasselli, from the University of Milan, revealed how difficult it had been to treat coronavirus patients 

They said: “We are seeing a high percentage of positive cases being admitted to our intensive care units (ICUs), in the range of 10 per cent of all positive patients.

“We wish to convey a strong message: Get ready 

They said: “We are seeing a high percentage of positive cases being admitted to our intensive care units (ICUs), in the range of 10 per cent of all positive patients.

They said Italian hospitals had seen “a very high” number of intensive care patients who were admitted “almost entirely” for severe lung failure caused by the virus and needing ventilators to help them breathe.


“We wish to convey a strong message: Get ready

They added: “Increase your total ICU capacity. Identify early hospitals that can manage the initial surge in a safe way. Get ready to prepare ICU areas where to cohort Covid-19 patients – in every hospital if necessary.”

In a separate note, Italian intensive care doctor Giuseppe Nattino, from the Lecco province in northern Italy, has shared a clinical summary of the patients his unit has been treating, which doctors described as “frightening” .

The technical note spells out how patients with coronavirus experience a severe infection in all of their lungs, requiring major ventilation support. It also reveals the effect of the virus, which affects blood pressure, the heart, kidneys and liver with patients needing sustained treatment.

In an alarming development, Dr Nattino said younger patients were being affected.

He added: “The last days are showing a younger population involved as if the elderly and weaker part of the population crashed early and now younger patients, having exhausted their physiological reserves, come to overcrowded, overwhelmed hospitals with little resources left.”

One UK doctor said this latter point needed careful consideration by NHS hospitals, adding: “We need to be careful to have some ICU capacity for younger patients. This is where important difficult decisions need to be made.


Full article link below

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-italy-doctors-intensive-care-deaths-a9384356.html

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Emswally Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 7:24pm

May need to change my shorts after reading that. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote EdwinSm, Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2020 at 10:33pm

For figures for the whole of Europe, you can check the European Centre for Disease Prevention and Control pages:

https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/cases-2019-ncov-eueea

                                         

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 08 2020 at 11:45am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Newbie1A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 08 2020 at 12:20pm

Do we have any members on here - on the ground in Italy (or Iran or China or So.Korea or...)?  

If yes, and you're comfortable stating 'how things are as you see them' please post!  I'm sure I'm not the only member on this forum who wishes for more first hand views of how this is unfolding in your countries and would love insight into what other countries & their citizens are doing (first hand)!


If it's to be - it's up to me!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thorne! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 08 2020 at 2:23pm

I posted this here due to the mention of Italy's CFR now 5%.

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/trump-boasts-we-have-perfectly-coordinated-plan-stop-virus-16-million-italians-wake

No comment on Trump's "perfectly coordinated plan".

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 09 2020 at 6:31pm

Deaths increased 366- 463 overnight infections increased by 24%

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-51810673

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 6:01am

https://www.livescience.com/why-italy-coronavirus-deaths-so-high.html


Fatality rate of 5%

23% of Italy over age of 65

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WitchMisspelled Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 8:05am

And Italy's healthcare ranks in the top five or so world-wide.  I don't think the U.S. ranks in the top 30.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 8:14am
ERCD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Hazelpad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 8:31am

Unfortunately I dont think it is as simple as he old dying over the young .The medics are clearly saying they have to triage who gets treatment and access to the ventilator s.  Patient will use one machine for weeks this is a long illness.

.and that's not  the old that are getting the places.  The deaths by age is being skewed toward the older population because they arent getting front of the queue. They are being put in dying rooms with less care.   This is what the doctors in Italy are repeatedly saying.


Quite "Thinking for a long time if and what to write about what is happening to us, I felt that the silence was not at all responsible," Dr Macchini said

In these two years I have learned that the people of Bergamo do not come to the emergency room for nothing. They behaved properly this time too. They followed all the indications given: a week or ten days at home with a fever without going out and risking contagion, but now they can't take it anymore."

"They don't breathe enough, they need oxygen."


Another doctor from Bergamo, anaesthesiologist Christian Salaroli, told Italian newspaper Corriere della Sera that doctors are now forced to choose who to treat on the basis of the patients' chances of survival.

"We can't attempt miracles. It's the reality," he said.

The Italian society of anaesthesiology and intensive care published 15 ethical recommendations to consider when deciding on ICU admissions during the virus crisis and the ICU shortage. The criteria include the age of the patient and the probability of survival, and not just "first come first served".

In his post, Dr Macchini wrote: "One after the other, the departments that had been emptied are filling up at an impressive rate".

"The display boards with the names of the patients, in different colours depending on the operating unit they belong to, are now all red and instead of the surgical operation there is the diagnosis, which is always the same damned one: bilateral interstitial pneumonia."

He also stressed the virus does not just affect old people, warning that younger people "end up intubated in intensive care" or "worse in ECMO (a machine for the worst cases, which extracts the blood, re-oxygenates it and returns it to the body, waiting for the organism, hopefully, heal your lungs).

He bitterly scorned people "on social networks who pride themselves on not being afraid and ignoring the rules, complaining because their normal lifestyle habits are 'temporarily' in crisis - all the while an epidemiological disaster is taking place



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 10:40am

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/italy-death-toll-rises-coronavirus-a4383806.html

Deaths increased by 168 ,  631 dead

9,172 to 10,149 infections10.7% increase

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 11:35am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pandemic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 11:53am

Originally posted by Pixie Pixie wrote:

https://www.livescience.com/why-italy-coronavirus-deaths-so-high.html


Fatality rate of 5%

23% of Italy over age of 65


Now 6%+ CFR

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiMum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 12:32pm

What a terrible choice to have to make but I can understand why they are choosing to help the young over the old. I always find it surprising when I hear of an elderly person being given an organ transplant - recently there was an 86 year old man who go one - and I think "was there not a younger person on the recipient list?" When donors are in such short supply I can't see how they can justify giving an organ to an elderly person if there are younger ones waiting too. 

I think we're going to see the exact same high death rate in all other western countries are their medical staff are forced to triage so ruthlessly too. I feel very sorry for the doctors who have to make these decisions. I'm sure it will haunt them.

You can't fix stupid.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 12:46pm

Some Dr guest on Brooke  Baldwin's show  said the U.S. Is just a few weeks behind where Italy is at this time.i live near the hospital,right up the hill,When I start hearing sirens consistently I'll know things are picking up in the community. The stress of waiting for this to explode,I can almost see my hair turn gray.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pandemic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 1:05pm

Originally posted by KiwiMum KiwiMum wrote:

What a terrible choice to have to make but I can understand why they are choosing to help the young over the old. I always find it surprising when I hear of an elderly person being given an organ transplant - recently there was an 86 year old man who go one - and I think "was there not a younger person on the recipient list?" When donors are in such short supply I can't see how they can justify giving an organ to an elderly person if there are younger ones waiting too. 

I think we're going to see the exact same high death rate in all other western countries are their medical staff are forced to triage so ruthlessly too. I feel very sorry for the doctors who have to make these decisions. I'm sure it will haunt them.

Whilst you make a valid point, I despair when I hear ' is that patient worth saving'. My Mother was diagnosed with lymphoma aged 84. I thought they wrote her off but she did undergo chemo. She survived and passed away peacefully aged 97. 


THE UK is going to be forced into choosing and one of reasons being it is underfunded !.


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Good thing I'm already gray.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Thorne! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 2:42pm

Originally posted by WitchMisspelled WitchMisspelled wrote:

Good thing I'm already gray.  

It's not gray.. . . . its silver! As I keep telling my wife. . . "chicks dig silver, so get with the program!"

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WitchMisspelled Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 2:45pm

Originally posted by Thorne! Thorne! wrote:

Originally posted by WitchMisspelled WitchMisspelled wrote:

Good thing I'm already gray.  

It's not gray.. . . . its silver! As I keep telling my wife. . . "chicks dig silver, so get with the program!"



So is mine.. nice shiny silver.  But I didn't want to make anyone jealous    

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiminNM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 10 2020 at 3:09pm

Originally posted by Pixie Pixie wrote:

Some Dr guest on Brooke  Baldwin's show  said the U.S. Is just a few weeks behind where Italy is at this time.i live near the hospital,right up the hill,When I start hearing sirens consistently I'll know things are picking up in the community. The stress of waiting for this to explode,I can almost see my hair turn gray.

I just posted a new post on this. 11.5 days according to the graph. UGH.   

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 11 2020 at 3:17am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 11 2020 at 1:19pm

Rhttps://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/11/italy-faces-calls-to-close-everything-to-tackle-coronavirus

631-827 deaths      Cases rose 31% overnight,article doesn't mention a figure of 2,000 overnight infections though, which I heard on the news.There is something unrelentlng about this virus,I don't buy into conspiracy  but this is  a biblical pestilence.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Glupa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 11 2020 at 2:18pm

I don’t do conspiracy theories either Pixie but I’m certain there’s more to this bug than we know. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FluMom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 11 2020 at 2:23pm

Well people are not paying attention to Italy, had a friend make fun of Covid19 today, got testy with her and she backed off.  Her daughter works in a hospital and is in her late 20s early 30s.  It will not be a laughing matter if her daughter is on a vent!  

There is a lot more to this virus and it could mutate and get worse hope not but it is not slowing down so it is a very happy virus moving from person to person!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tabitha111 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 11 2020 at 3:30pm

Just regal her with stories about the 36 year old woman in Nebraska that is in critical condition or the 32 year old with no underlying health issues who is getting worse and worse, or the 20 year old that is on a vent due to Covid 19...those are the stories I tell my 30 year old son so he doesn't become too complacent. 


I want him to realize that not just grandma and grandpa are in danger.
I also told him about the Biogen meeting of all business men, surely not all of them were 70+ years old, yet there are 70 positive and 34 in hospital (these figures are from memory, so may not be exact)….


I also want to say that my 88 year old father (at the time) was dx with gastric cancer a year ago and the really only life saving measure is to remove the stomach...the doctors at Walter Reed held a meeting to decide if they should go ahead and do this for my father...it is almost unheard of in that age range to do this operation...but thankfully his surgeon said he was going to do it...over the objections of the other mds….and my father made it to his 89th and is a year recovered and cancer free...he might not be here today if not for that decision...yet him and my mother went out to eat at Carrabbas last night and refuse to not go to church...sigh....

'When you feel as though you can't do something, the simple antidote is action: Begin doing it. Start the process, even if it's just a simple step, and don't stop at the beginning.'
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pixie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 12 2020 at 3:57am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pheasant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 12 2020 at 8:29am

               Italian actor Luca Franzese pleads for help in video showing dead sister            

                                       

By Yaron Steinbuch

                                             

       March 12, 2020 | 11:12am            

               


                                       Enlarge Image     https://www.facebook.com/luca.franzese.5/videos/2836001859830912/                   

                               

               

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An Italian actor who appeared in the TV drama “Gomorrah” has posted a heartbreaking video pleading for help as the body of his sister, who died of the coronavirus, is seen in the background.

Luca Franzese, a mixed martial arts trainer, was trapped in his Naples home with the decaying body of Teresa Franzese, who died of the illness on Saturday.

“I am waiting for the institutions to give me answers since last night. Nobody came forward,” the grief-stricken man said Sunday in the emotional video posted on Facebook.

“This is a very strong video, please don’t show it to children and elderly people. I am forced in all my pain to fight this situation — I have my sister here in bed, dead. I don’t know what to do, I can’t honor her as she deserves because institutions abandoned me,” he said.

“I contacted everyone, but nobody was able to give me an answer,” said Franzese, who was unable to find a funeral home that would bury his sister.

Italy, where all 60 million inhabitants remain under lockdown, has confirmed 827 deaths from the coronavirus and identified more than 12,000 cases.

The 47-year-old woman, who suffered from a form of epilepsy but was otherwise in good health, had developed symptoms of coronavirus a just a few days before she died, according to Al Jazeera.

At her brother’s insistence, Teresa was tested for the virus after she died and confirmed to have been infected, the news outlet reported.

Franzese said health officials refused to test him because they said they first had to know whether she was infected.

“I self-isolated myself. Today I could go anywhere to spread the virus if I have it because I gave my sister a mouth-to-mouth to keep her alive and no one cared,” he said.

“Guys, we are ruined, Italy abandoned us, let’s support each other. I beg you to spread this video everywhere — make it go viral,” he added. “This is my sister, can you see her? She’s in bed, since yesterday.”

The video — which has been viewed almost 10 million times – prompted a local politician to intervene and succeeded in finding a funeral home for the family.

“It was surreal,” said Pasquale Pernice, who works at the Aprea Funeral Home, according to Al Jazeera.

                       

see also

                                                                                           

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                           

Italian doctor at heart of illness shares chilling coronavirus thoughts

                                                                       
                                                                           

                                                           

“We used masks, sterile shoes, hazmat suits, glasses and gloves. Luca and another relative were there, but other family members were all in another room,” Penice said.

No family members were present during the burial.

“If it gets worse, and we have to do it again, we will. It’s our job,” Pernice added.

Francesco Emilio Borrelli, a member of the Regional Health Commission for Campania, told Al Jazeera that the woman’s death was the first case in the country in which a person with coronavirus died at home, “so there was some confusion on what to do.”

“The family [exemplifies] altruism, they are doing everything they can to protect their community, and the community is staying close to them by bringing food,” he told the outlet.

“Now the big problem is that they have been closed in there for four days, and no one is taking away their trash. It’s getting unhygienic and we don’t know what to do about it. Someone needs to help them.”

The only thing we have to fear, is fear itself......FDR
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 12 2020 at 8:54am

Unbelievably horriffic!  That poor man.

I've run out of words.

ERCD
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