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Online Discussion: Tracking new emerging diseases and the next pandemic since 2005; Coronavirus COVID-19 Pandemic Discussion Forum.

Mix & Match vaccination trials

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CRS, DrPH View Drop Down
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    Posted: July 31 2021 at 4:14pm

I have long considered the possibility that combining different vaccines (Moderna, Pfizer, J&J etc.) would generate an enhanced immune response, and I am seeing data for such "mix and match" trials in the literature:

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-01805-2

Since I had two Moderna jabs, I would be particularly interested in a Pfizer booster!  Subtle differences in the vaccines may generate some surprising responses.  

I'd be willing to sign a waiver in order to receive a booster right now, I wish the US regulatory agencies weren't dragging their feet.  They were burned in the 1976 "swine flu" outbreak, when several Americans had severe reactions (GBS) to a rushed vaccine. 

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carbon20 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2021 at 4:30pm

I've said similar,

After my next AZ I'll get a Pifzer......

Delta isn't the last variant we are going to see......

And until a "harmless"  mutation appears I'll have a booster every year......

Thats If and when my State opens up to World......

Not looking likely at the moment though......


I'll still take a shot  though.....when offered......

Take care all 😷😉


Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth.🖖

Marcus Aurelius
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July 31 2021 at 10:43pm

Originally posted by carbon20 carbon20 wrote:

I've said similar,

After my next AZ I'll get a Pifzer......

Delta isn't the last variant we are going to see......

And until a "harmless"  mutation appears I'll have a booster every year......

Thats If and when my State opens up to World......

Not looking likely at the moment though......


I'll still take a shot  though.....when offered......

Take care all 😷😉


Thanks!  WTF is going on in Sydney?  

I hope you folks don't go daft like we Americans!  

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/31/covid-cases-surge-in-sydney-police-cordon-off-downtown-to-prevent-rally.html

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carbon20 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2021 at 2:07am

Indeed ....

WTF,

is going on in Sydney, politics,and Delta strain,

Can't fix stupid...

Glad I'm 4 thousand kilometres away....

One road in...

 one airport....

With hard borders.....

Take care all 😷😉

Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth.🖖

Marcus Aurelius
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2021 at 1:55pm

Originally posted by carbon20 carbon20 wrote:

Indeed ....

WTF,

is going on in Sydney, politics,and Delta strain,

Can't fix stupid...

Glad I'm 4 thousand kilometres away....

One road in...

 one airport....

With hard borders.....

Take care all 😷😉

You are in Perth, correct?  Yeah, that is pretty isolated country!  Cheers, mate, be safe!

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carbon20 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2021 at 2:46pm

Most isolated city in the world......

2million people in an area that could fit,

Texas,Japan,and the UK......


Phew...... counting my blessings....

Take care all 😷😉

Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth.🖖

Marcus Aurelius
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 01 2021 at 9:31pm

Originally posted by carbon20 carbon20 wrote:

Most isolated city in the world......

2million people in an area that could fit,

Texas,Japan,and the UK......


Phew...... counting my blessings....

Take care all 😷😉

Sounds grand, actually!    

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ViQueen24 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 02 2021 at 7:12am

Chuck, if you wouldn't mind speculating, in what ways could mixing different vaccine brands enhance immune response, and possible side effects?  I value your input very much as my mother and I steer toward the autumn!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 02 2021 at 4:18pm

Originally posted by ViQueen24 ViQueen24 wrote:

Chuck, if you wouldn't mind speculating, in what ways could mixing different vaccine brands enhance immune response, and possible side effects?  I value your input very much as my mother and I steer toward the autumn!

Hi Claudia!  This is my thinking….


All of the vaccines used to fight COVID stimulate our immune response to the SARS-CoV2 spike protein - however, since we all are unique genetically, our response to each vaccine also will vary, although in subtle ways.  


Also, each manufacturing process will tend to vary.  Recall that Pfizer requires ultra-cold storage, whereas Moderna does not - both are mRNA based vaccines, so there is some difference in composition or manufacturing at play. 


The J&J vaccine uses an attenuated human virus to carry the viral RNA into our cells for expression, which is a drastically different approach than the mRNA vaccine.  


https://www.vcuhealth.org/news/covid-19/johnson-and-johnson-vaccine-how-is-it-different


Therefore, I am guessing that “mixing and matching” vaccines might produce an enhanced response through subtle genetic and chemical expression mechanisms.  CDC has not yet indicated that we need boosters, but the Israelis are providing booster shots, and I think it will be coming to the rest of us soon.  


http://myvax.com.s3.amazonaws.com/uploads/my_vax_article/article/d41586-021-01359-3.pdf


I’m not an MD, just a scientist, so this is all off-the-cuff thinking, and I’ll follow CDC’s recommendations.  However, I think it will be shown that mixing & matching vaccines will provide some added protection.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 02 2021 at 5:05pm

I'm neither an MD, nor a scientist, just a housewife, but I think quite clearly (usually) and avidly follow the science.  

That sounds 100% logical, Chuck.

How do you tell if a politician is lying?
His lips or pen are moving.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 02 2021 at 6:06pm

Originally posted by Technophobe Technophobe wrote:

I'm neither an MD, nor a scientist, just a housewife, but I think quite clearly (usually) and avidly follow the science.  

That sounds 100% logical, Chuck.

You always amaze me, Techno!!  

I try to never BS anyone, just tell it straight. 

If I hear anything important, I'll check in.  

Take care out there, this thing is winding up.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Technophobe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2021 at 4:00am

I have slept on this and now think I can sum the science up:

Mixing and matching vaccines definitely does not reduce vaccine effectiveness; it may actually increase it. Chosing a booster vaccine made a different way probably increases it even more.

How do you tell if a politician is lying?
His lips or pen are moving.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote carbon20 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 03 2021 at 4:15am

The way I look at it is ,

Having a different type of vaccine that is a " good " variant,  making the body react in a good positive  different way has to be  better ,no real different than having a flu vaccine every year.....

same but different....!???

Take care all 😷😉


Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth.🖖

Marcus Aurelius
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CRS, DrPH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August 04 2021 at 12:57am

Originally posted by carbon20 carbon20 wrote:

The way I look at it is ,

Having a different type of vaccine that is a " good " variant,  making the body react in a good positive  different way has to be  better ,no real different than having a flu vaccine every year.....

same but different....!???

Take care all 😷😉


Right you are!  This is a very good & understandable article on the topic of mixing & matching.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/07/26/delta-people-are-mixing-and-matching-covid-vaccines-over-concerns-about-variant.html

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