Trump in the briefing today said that the flu is far worse, and more people die in car accdients.   

Clear White House message - is that the flu is worse and this is overblown. 

Not sure what to think.  Is Trump correct, and yes he is major conman lol, but is he doing a con or is thing basically over as he claims?  Would love for this to be over as he is saying. 

Any thoughts?

I would find it difficult to predict the road fatality road for the next Year. However, based on tried and tested variables, I could possibly estimate the number based on historical charts. At the Year's end, I could reconcile the data.

Does that help ?

It's a "Novel" virus that causes lung lesions,

It's not the same as the flu,The flu is still happening

Obvously that is 100% wrong*.  I don't know if he is trying to be re-assuring, playing stupid or just being really stupid.  But again, you are stuck with him for now, so make the best of it and support him.  Any other approach is self defeating.

*In defiance of normal mathematics, I could make an argument for that being 1000% wrong:

1000% = 10 X  

This bug is going to kill 10 X as many as seasonal flu

∴  that statement = 1000% wrong.

It's all tough to tell.  In today's briefing, Trump made it clear the flu is worse, and basically everything is worse.   Yes, he is an impeached Prez and major conman, but what he did all today barely fell short of calling it a hoax and giving "the all clear".  Not sure what to think. 

I'm sure as hell not prepping now lol... and going to use my current preps.   Hope he is not doing a con again in all of this, 

Look everyone is on his butt for listening to the Doctors and closing down the country.  So I say after the 7 days left open it up.  If people die because they whined enough for money so be it.  The man is doing his best to make everyone happy and no one is happy so let everyone in every state do what they want.  Go back to school, go back to work if they die they die.  

Well, in the briefing today, all I got is that the flu is worse, and so are car accidents lol.     I'm sure as hell not prepping whatsoever now.   I have already spent too much money prepping, and if Trump says it's overblown and basically nothing and the flu is far worse, not choice but to trust him.    I hardly ever get the flu.... so not sure why I would prep for something far less severe.  

Albert wrote: Trump in the briefing today said that the flu is far worse, and more people die in car accdients.    Clear White House message - is that the flu is worse and this is overblown.  Not sure what to think.  Is Trump correct, and yes he is major conman lol, but is he doing a con or is thing basically over as he claims?  Would love for this to be over as he is saying.  Any thoughts?

I think this is *WAY* overblown. 

That's not to say that it isn't serious, but the thing is that for the vast majority of people this is little more than an influenza.

There is a lot of focus on death rates which of course matters.  However, the 20% hospitalization rate is the most worrying.  The death rate will be much higher if these people don't get help and they won't if the hospital systems are overrun.   Never mind the usual car accidents, flu, heart attacks, etc.  In my area the system is strained, medical professionals are begging for proper equipment, a field hospital is being set up, and a neighbor got hauled off by medics in hazmat suits.  The economy matters too, just not sure how you balance both at the same time.  

I dunno... cases here in NY  were  20,875  this morning with 400 dead.   NY alone has 5% of the world-wide cases.  Doesn't feel like just the flu to me...

It is not the flu...this is a killer but people don't want to SIP they want their jobs back they want their  cushy  lives back and the press wants Trump to make a misstep so they can hound him.  Put that all in the bowl and mix it up and we will have to wait to see who wins this the greedy/cushy people or the doctors who see a freight train coming down the tracks!

Don't be tricked by normalcy bias and gaslighting.  You're too smart for that..

Also don't we think perhaps he was trying to light a fire under Congress' @$$?

We STILL don't know what the denominator is.  We keep hearing reports that maybe even a majority of cases are asymptomatic.   Only the sick are being tested.   We need to test the population at large.    Antibody tests would also be a huge help.

Case in point.... by far South Korea has done the most testing, and as a result they have the lowest CFR.

Turboguy wrote: Albert wrote: Trump in the briefing today said that the flu is far worse, and more people die in car accdients.    Clear White House message - is that the flu is worse and this is overblown.  Not sure what to think.  Is Trump correct, and yes he is major conman lol, but is he doing a con or is thing basically over as he claims?  Would love for this to be over as he is saying.  Any thoughts? I think this is *WAY* overblown.  That's not to say that it isn't serious, but the thing is that for the vast majority of people this is little more than an influenza.

Hi  Turbo my friend, 

Question - did you ever test positive for COVID-19?  Never heard about the final results.   Did you just have the flu?    

I am having a very hard time understanding this crap.  Ok, we haven't even reached the exponential peak yet and everyone wants to call this off ?  Italy has not even reached it's peak yet.   I don't believe that you guys would drop your guards.  We are three weeks away from the peak here..  Have aliens gotten into your bodies ?   You are all making a huge mistake in  thinking that this is over blown.  It is not, we have a  novel virus with many deadly ways ot kill you. it Is 3x as contagious as the flu and you want to stop prepping ? 

ME163 wrote: I am having a very hard time understanding this crap.  Ok, we haven't even reached the exponential peak yet and everyone wants to call this off ?  Italy has not even reached it's peak yet.   I don't believe that you guys would drop your guards.  We are three weeks away from the peak here..  Have aliens gotten into your bodies ?   You are all making a huge mistake in  thinking that this is over blown.  It is not, we have a  novel virus with many deadly ways ot kill you. it Is 3x as contagious as the flu and you want to stop prepping ?

I agree at this point in time. I looked at numbers for Italy. The flu stat I could find was 68,000 for 5 years ('13-17 I think it was) so 13,600/yr.  UNLESS they are saying 65k/yr but they didn't make it clear and it sounded like that was 'for the 5 years'... so thinking 13,600/yr - if flu season is 6 mos long - that's  2266/mos or if it's 4 mos long that's 3400/mos.  They've lost over 5000 this month so that's from 2.1x to 1.6x approx. a flu month.   I think we're just heading into the tornado.... and people better be ready to hang on!   I'm HOPING this is all overblown, but a lot have said from the very beginning of this - it's the other fall out from it that is truly going to change our lives/livelyhoods and cause much more damage.  I am having a hard time balancing what the government is/isn't doing with the numbers we're seeing - just not sure what the true agenda is here!

Trump Considers Reopening Economy, Over Health Experts’ Objections

Officials have said the federal government’s initial 15-day period for social distancing is vital to slowing the spread of the virus, which has already infected more than 40,000 people in the United States. But Mr. Trump and a chorus of conservative voices have begun to suggest that the shock to the economy could hurt the country more than deaths from the virus.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-considers-reopening-economy-over-health-experts-objections/ar-BB11Byry?ocid=msedgntp - https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-considers-reopening-economy-over-health-experts-objections/ar-BB11Byry?ocid=msedgntp

Read this it will help you understand what Trump is going though.

ok, now I get it , You are all scared of the economic aspect and therefore have gotten cold feet about the data and the curve.  You would rather have thousands die than wreck our economy.  This is really sad, it is not the flu.  You are really hoping it will blow over and we can return to leave it to beaver ?    Don't think so,  This virus Is a tough one and  we have no natural immunity to it .  This scares you to death and you are now looking for a way to denial.  This virus has just started its march.   Is this because Trump has decided  to end the emergency AFTER  14 days because of the economic aspects?   If this is how you all really feel then I am out of here.  This site has become a rah rah trump site. I am sorry, but I would rather look at the evidence and see the explosive growth of this virus.   The price of public health is high when people don't plan ahead , have a  haphazard plan when the do and  fail to put people first over special interests.  

DeepThinker wrote: We STILL don't know what the denominator is.  We keep hearing reports that maybe even a majority of cases are asymptomatic.   Only the sick are being tested.   We need to test the population at large.    Antibody tests would also be a huge help. Case in point.... by far South Korea has done the most testing, and as a result they have the lowest CFR.

There is NO WAY they're going to make 300 million+ test kits and test the entire population. That is crazy. 

The other problem with that idea is that theyre not going to have the ability to test every man, woman, and child at the same time. You could get tested today and catch it tomorrow from someone else who hasn't been tested yet, that's a wasted test, now you get sick and get tested again, hey two tests and now we start second guessing whether or not the tests work in the first place. 

The real rub with this thing is that some people have zero symptoms and everyone who gets it is asymptomatic for a week, yet shedding virus infecting others and they have no idea. 

Testing everyone in the U.S. is not logistically, mathematically, or even were it possible, would be a colossal waste of time and resources. 

ME163, I do not think this is overblown.  I agree with you, the horses have barely left the gate and we're calling it a day.   I have zero confidence and will fend for myself accordingly.   Hope you will stick around.  

Albert wrote: Turboguy wrote: Albert wrote: Trump in the briefing today said that the flu is far worse, and more people die in car accdients.    Clear White House message - is that the flu is worse and this is overblown.  Not sure what to think.  Is Trump correct, and yes he is major conman lol, but is he doing a con or is thing basically over as he claims?  Would love for this to be over as he is saying.  Any thoughts? I think this is *WAY* overblown.  That's not to say that it isn't serious, but the thing is that for the vast majority of people this is little more than an influenza. Hi  Turbo my friend,  Question - did you ever test positive for COVID-19?  Never heard about the final results.   Did you just have the flu?

They never said what the hell I had. They required me to call into the CDC twice a day, stay isolated, etc even though they said my Covid 19 test was negative. 

It got to the point that I got sick of the nasty lady I would sometimes get when I called. 

She would ask if I had gone out. No. 

What are your symptoms? Cough, fever, etc.

Do you have any new symptoms? No...

And she was hugely condescending. Like I was wasting her time. A couple calls ago I asked her if she could maybe be a little more pleasant. Her answer: I don't need to. I have started trolling her savagely every time I call and get her. Got her yesterday and this is word for word our last conversation. 

Have you broken isolation? 

Yeah, I am currently climbing Mount Everest. 

YOU NEED TO TAKE THIS SERIOUS!!! 

Maybe you shouldn't act like I am wasting your time there, GS5. 

Whatevah, whats'cho current symptom? 

I am now green and spend my time shambling about seeking the brains of the living to devour... ughhhhhhh

I SAID YOU NEED TA TAKE DIS SERIOUS! 

Or what?

Or else Imma...

Yousa gonna get mad? Hey what rhymes with dick?

*CLICK* I hung up on her. 

I have zero sympathy for people who want to be unpleasant and get nasty with people they're literally getting paid to talk to. I have to be nice to people for my job where people do stupid shit all the time, she can too. I hope they're recording those calls. 

I have not given up but the masses are not happy they want what they want.  I am in a school and I can tell you the 30-40 somethings are self centered and have a lot of messed up ideals.  So if they want this let the people like us stay at home and watch what happens...1918 all over again!

Turboguy wrote: DeepThinker wrote: We STILL don't know what the denominator is.  We keep hearing reports that maybe even a majority of cases are asymptomatic.   Only the sick are being tested.   We need to test the population at large.    Antibody tests would also be a huge help. Case in point.... by far South Korea has done the most testing, and as a result they have the lowest CFR. There is NO WAY they're going to make 300 million+ test kits and test the entire population. That is crazy.  The other problem with that idea is that theyre not going to have the ability to test every man, woman, and child at the same time. You could get tested today and catch it tomorrow from someone else who hasn't been tested yet, that's a wasted test, now you get sick and get tested again, hey two tests and now we start second guessing whether or not the tests work in the first place.  The real rub with this thing is that some people have zero symptoms and everyone who gets it is asymptomatic for a week, yet shedding virus infecting others and they have no idea.  Testing everyone in the U.S. is not logistically, mathematically, or even were it possible, would be a colossal waste of time and resources.

Yes it is unrealstic to test all 300million of us.  However large random samples from around the country would be helpful.   If we are only testing the symptomatic cases we are probably not getting a good picture of how far along we are.     We are repeating the same mistake that we did with swineflu in Mexico City.   Everyone was terrified we had a very severe outbreak that was just starting.... when it turns out it was  mild but peaking.

It's important to understand all of what Trump is doing (and Kudlow and Mnuchin, and everyone else) is messaging the markets. He's trying to jawbone the markets from collapsing, that's all. If he told them the truth, everyone would sell. Complete pandamonium. He knows this It's all an act. 

He knows the shutdown will last for more than a few weeks. Can't let the markets, and his voters, know this.

Remember Kudlow "essentially contained" and now "no one could have ever seen this coming". It's all bullshit.

He's just playing a psych game. Don't be fooled. I think he has NO actual intention of recommending the orders lifted anytime soon (besides he did not give the orders - the STATES AND LOCALS DID! He can recommend, but that's all that is. They "recommend")

ME163 wrote: ok, now I get it , You are all scared of the economic aspect and therefore have gotten cold feet about the data and the curve.  You would rather have thousands die than wreck our economy.  This is really sad, it is not the flu.  You are really hoping it will blow over and we can return to leave it to beaver ?    Don't think so,  This virus Is a tough one and  we have no natural immunity to it .  This scares you to death and you are now looking for a way to denial.  This virus has just started its march.   Is this because Trump has decided  to end the emergency AFTER  14 days because of the economic aspects?   If this is how you all really feel then I am out of here.  This site has become a rah rah trump site. I am sorry, but I would rather look at the evidence and see the explosive growth of this virus.   The price of public health is high when people don't plan ahead , have a  haphazard plan when the do and  fail to put people first over special interests.

Totally agree. Everyone is panicking in their own way. It's real. And it's going to fuck us up, one way or another. Basically the bargaining stage, more like surrender. 

Read that post I put up "Must Read" about what will happen if this is lifted early. No one seems to learn from history (1918)

Hi folks. Found this forum back in the Ebola days. Found it again in January and signed up a couple days ago. While I don't think this virus is super deadly, It clearly seems bad enough to overwhelm our heath care and maybe cause civil unrest. In the US, I think we take our freedoms very seriously while many are totally reliant on the government to take care of them. I also think there are plenty of ignorant people in my country capable of throwing epic temper tantrums...with guns. 

Maybe all governments are between a rock and a hard place.. probably overwhelm the hospitals no matter what they do... so the right answer may be to let it burn, accept the deaths, and get back to business sooner. 

We will stay indoors for the next 2-4 months (with our guns and preps) and ensure our family is safe. When we can easily get a test with mild symptoms, there are plenty of proven treatments available, and the hospitals aren't overrun, we will re-emerge. Don't want my family to take one (or several) for the economy... Just what I'm doing. Hope I'm wrong.

I totally will think Trump will be wrong if he gives in and stops the shut down 7 days from now.  I work for these 30-40 somethings well their kids and they are spoiled and they went through 9/11 so they think no one should speak above a whisper to their children, they travel the world, have second homes, own all kinds of toys, and have nanny's for their kids when they are not in school.   The poor ones are working two jobs to make ends meet and their kids are left alone a lot of the time if grandma and grandpa do not live in town.   These people have never lived in tough times from 20 - 49. 

The President I think is getting pressure from people who want to make money to stop this shut down and go back to "regular" life...the doctors behind him do not want this to happen.  I think some Governors are feeling the pressure to open business not NY, CA or WA they are facing the Grim Reaper.

This is going to get interesting...for me I SIP at least until August then I will see what I will do. 

I agree with Babycat. He didn’t say he was going to reopen everything, he said we’d see at the end of 15 days which was the plan along. I think he was trying to give hope to the ones complaining the most that may only have 1 or 2 cases and wonder why their town has to be shut down. There were several so called experts saying we’d have to be in lock down for 18 months which I think rattled a lot of people. Let’s see what happens this week with the ramped up testing but they said they would look to the data before making recommendations.

Maybe we shouldn't use a broad stroke for people in their 40s? I am ex-military, an engineer, and yes I was active duty when 9/11 happened. But I am well-informed, I don't whisper to my children, and my family is well prepared. Thx.

The fact is, nobody knows.....there is no "right" answer.

   Ghandi could be in charge right now and get criticized by one side or the other.......only history will give us the correct course.

   In almost every other category of things that take lives, most are results of decisions people make, or are otherwise have statistically predictable results......ie: we choose to take the risk.

   There is a reason the virus is called "novel" nobody knows whats going to happen.....and that is uncharted territory for our species.

   So expect wobbles in leadership and courses of action.

You can recover from bankrupt.  You can't recover from dead.

The economists need to get off of Trump's arse and let him lead.  He is imperfect, but doing his best and learning on-the-hoof.

The economically driven die just as easily!

An interesting read that kind of fits this discussion:

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/william-watson-herd-mentality-versus-herd-immunity-and-the-coronavirus/ar-BB11BuoK?ocid=spartandhp - https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/william-watson-herd-mentality-versus-herd-immunity-and-the-coronavirus/ar-BB11BuoK?ocid=spartandhp

BabyCat wrote: ME163 wrote: ok, now I get it , You are all scared of the economic aspect and therefore have gotten cold feet about the data and the curve.  You would rather have thousands die than wreck our economy.  This is really sad, it is not the flu.  You are really hoping it will blow over and we can return to leave it to beaver ?    Don't think so,  This virus Is a tough one and  we have no natural immunity to it .  This scares you to death and you are now looking for a way to denial.  This virus has just started its march.   Is this because Trump has decided  to end the emergency AFTER  14 days because of the economic aspects?   If this is how you all really feel then I am out of here.  This site has become a rah rah trump site. I am sorry, but I would rather look at the evidence and see the explosive growth of this virus.   The price of public health is high when people don't plan ahead , have a  haphazard plan when the do and  fail to put people first over special interests.   Totally agree. Everyone is panicking in their own way. It's real. And it's going to fuck us up, one way or another. Basically the bargaining stage, more like surrender.  Read that post I put up "Must Read" about what will happen if this is lifted early. No one seems to learn from history (1918)

I'm with the two of you. 100%.  

KiminNM wrote: BabyCat wrote: ME163 wrote: ok, now I get it , You are all scared of the economic aspect and therefore have gotten cold feet about the data and the curve.  You would rather have thousands die than wreck our economy.  This is really sad, it is not the flu.  You are really hoping it will blow over and we can return to leave it to beaver ?    Don't think so,  This virus Is a tough one and  we have no natural immunity to it .  This scares you to death and you are now looking for a way to denial.  This virus has just started its march.   Is this because Trump has decided  to end the emergency AFTER  14 days because of the economic aspects?   If this is how you all really feel then I am out of here.  This site has become a rah rah trump site. I am sorry, but I would rather look at the evidence and see the explosive growth of this virus.   The price of public health is high when people don't plan ahead , have a  haphazard plan when the do and  fail to put people first over special interests.   Totally agree. Everyone is panicking in their own way. It's real. And it's going to fuck us up, one way or another. Basically the bargaining stage, more like surrender.  Read that post I put up "Must Read" about what will happen if this is lifted early. No one seems to learn from history (1918) I'm with the two of you. 100%.

I agree with these sentiments completely. I am quite discouraged at the paranoia that some are exhibiting any time anyone says anything critical of the Trump administration. I find myself checking in less and less because there aren’t as many thoughtful posts or responses anymore. At the beginning of all of this I learned a lot from on here. And I now don’t even want to post anything because I am scared of getting yelled at for being critical of Trump or what I do post lately gets buried and no one responds. 🤷🏻‍♀️

this is exactly the thing I am talking about, fatalism and defeatism.  South Korea beat this thing with testing, contract tracing and social distancing.  It is not perfect , but it works, Human life is more important than money or the economy.    

have any of you that maybe he was trying to send a message to congress that if they don’t act he would let ip on restriction and let virus take off just to piss them off ?  Also AARP sent him a letter saying that the older generation can take care of themselves and that trashing the economy would not help their grandchildren

This is a crock, for one, think  about  extreme measures to save lives after natural disasters, etc etc.  This reminds me of Stalinist Russia where lives were disposable and gold was not.  This whole series of articles and opinions are designed to give a basis to those who would abandon the job of saving lives to fix an economy that is falling apart anyway. . Public health is worth more than the money lost.  

SheriAnn wrote: KiminNM wrote: BabyCat wrote: ME163 wrote: ok, now I get it , You are all scared of the economic aspect and therefore have gotten cold feet about the data and the curve.  You would rather have thousands die than wreck our economy.  This is really sad, it is not the flu.  You are really hoping it will blow over and we can return to leave it to beaver ?    Don't think so,  This virus Is a tough one and  we have no natural immunity to it .  This scares you to death and you are now looking for a way to denial.  This virus has just started its march.   Is this because Trump has decided  to end the emergency AFTER  14 days because of the economic aspects?   If this is how you all really feel then I am out of here.  This site has become a rah rah trump site. I am sorry, but I would rather look at the evidence and see the explosive growth of this virus.   The price of public health is high when people don't plan ahead , have a  haphazard plan when the do and  fail to put people first over special interests.   Totally agree. Everyone is panicking in their own way. It's real. And it's going to fuck us up, one way or another. Basically the bargaining stage, more like surrender.  Read that post I put up "Must Read" about what will happen if this is lifted early. No one seems to learn from history (1918) I'm with the two of you. 100%.   I agree with these sentiments completely. I am quite discouraged at the paranoia that some are exhibiting any time anyone says anything critical of the Trump administration. I find myself checking in less and less because there aren’t as many thoughtful posts or responses anymore. At the beginning of all of this I learned a lot from on here. And I now don’t even want to post anything because I am scared of getting yelled at for being critical of Trump or what I do post lately gets buried and no one responds. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Yup, yup, yup and big ol' ayup.  

I have two teachers in my family.  They're biggest problem is not the kids with behavior problems.  It's the parents of the kids with behavior problems.  Parents are called and point blame everywhere else, but the child.  That's what's happening here.  

Ignore the political rants - they are a distraction.  This site still has the best info I have seen anywhere.  We knew of this LAST YEAR!  As far as I can tell, we have been ahead of the curve AT EVERY STEP!

Vent if you have to - you can PM me if your rant is too blue - I don't mind. You can ask me to move posts - It annoys me as I have to move each bit separately so long threads are really a strain!  But I will do it.  So ask me early in the discussion if you can - PLEASE!

But don't go.  The economy above people's lives maddens me more than I can say, but the nost rabid pro-Trumpians have some valuable info and we need your imput too.

I predict that at the end of the 15 days of restrictions he is going to tell the governors that restrictions stay in place for 60 and up and or persons of all ages with health issues and lift it for everyone else. This will be based on studies in NYC of under fire trials of treatments that work to treat anyone with health issues else safely We should know in another week if hyrdroxychlorquine and z pacs are viable treatment options

When there are first world countries that no longer have enough regular beds for people that are sick enough to need hospitalization, and ICU beds and ventilators to treat all the people that actually need them to survive, it’s not overblown. Milder symptoms may well be the norm, but nobody ever said the majority had to get really sick for an outbreak to be a big deal. Enough serious/critical cases and the healthcare system implodes, and then you have Italy, Iran and soon to be Spain, and quite possibly the US. I work in a medical clinic doing direct patient care and I still have to go to work, but I have friends working in hospital settings and EMS who are absolutely dreading what’s to come. I doubt any of the countries hardest hit by this would consider our response to be overblown.
Trump is protecting the market above all else, and it’ll come back to bite him on the ass if he “opens up” the country too early and we see the cases start to climb again. Taking advice from conservative influencers and ignoring the experts is a ridiculously cavalier attitude. I wouldn’t be surprised to see Fauci depart of his own accord soon. The man has clearly had enough of Trump and his insistence on making medical decisions with no training whatsoever to back them up.

Technophobe wrote: Ignore the political rants - they are a distraction.  This site still has the best info I have seen anywhere.  We knew of this LAST YEAR!  As far as I can tell, we have been ahead of the curve AT EVERY STEP! Vent if you have to - you can PM me if your rant is too blue - I don't mind. You can ask me to move posts - It annoys me as I have to move each bit separately so long threads are really a strain!  But I will do it.  So ask me early in the discussion if you can - PLEASE! But don't go.  The economy above people's lives maddens me more than I can say, but the nost rabid pro-Trumpians have some valuable info and we need your imput too.

I can't speak for the others, but there is only so much that can be ignored.  Particularly when it's so constant.  The message of "gold" prepping is drowned out by the ignorance, the insulting of people's intelligence and  pointing blame everywhere else... as long as its the Democrats and not their demagogue.  

Dr Fauci isn’t totally above board either. See link Tuesday, February 25, 2020 NIH clinical trial of remdesivir to treat COVID-19 begins Study enrolling hospitalized adults with COVID-19 in Nebraska. This study has finished and results are not good. Also Vaccine in Seatle trials has shown inconsistencies they can not explain. It worked for some but failed horribly in others. Actually may have caused them to get ill

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-clinical-trial-investigational-vaccine-covid-19-begins - https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-clinical-trial-investigational-vaccine-covid-19-begins

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-clinical-trial-remdesivir-treat-covid-19-begins - https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/nih-clinical-trial-remdesivir-treat-covid-19-begins

This just out last wed

https://drive.google.com/file/d/186Bel9RqfsmEx55FDum4xY_IlWSHnGbj/view?usp=embed_facebook - https://drive.google.com/file/d/186Bel9RqfsmEx55FDum4xY_IlWSHnGbj/view?usp=embed_facebook

I think  some are afraid this could lead to another great recession/depression. Then what would happen to many families? Would folks die as a result of that?   Many people live paycheck to pay check and if they don't work they don't eat.  Many have been laid off already. How will they feed their families they cant SIP if there is no food in the house because they are out of work.. From retail to delivery drivers to medical providers they put their lives at risk. they work so others can  have supplies or restaurant meals delivered to their homes, shop for necessities food meds, etc..  Not everyone has the luxury of SIP or jobs that allow, but the more that can SIP does help to slow covid 19 down to help alleviate overburdening the hospitals and medical staff.  Be safe if you have a job that requires you to be out. Thanks to all the medical staff, first responders, retail workers, all that are required to still work for all you do!

schools are out the remainder of the academic year where I live. so why would we not all be taking tight measures at least that long as well?

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/man-claims-anti-malaria-drug-touted-by-trump-to-treat-coronavirus-saved-him-from-death - https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/man-claims-anti-malaria-drug-touted-by-trump-to-treat-coronavirus-saved-him-from-death

I think the President is correct give it until Easter to keep people home they let the younger people go back to work with some restrictions on gathering places and businesses one rotations of some kind to keep people at a distance.  Old people and people with medical problems isolate.  That is what I am planning on until August.  Old folks home care takers use PPE to keep the old people well.  This can be done I thing by Easter too.  I am willing at 70 to stay home for the youth to go back to work!

Yes, I think that is what Trump is hearing from the over 70 generations. You are an amazing loving group or generation that are no foreigner to hardship and sacrifice. I have lost my own parents but my 86 year young mother in law is still with us and she thinks like you too. I hope the people in power here this generation and listen

Usk wrote: I predict that at the end of the 15 days of restrictions he is going to tell the governors that restrictions stay in place for 60 and up and or persons of all ages with health issues and lift it for everyone else. This will be based on studies in NYC of under fire trials of treatments that work to treat anyone with health issues else safely We should know in another week if hyrdroxychlorquine and z pacs are viable treatment options

Do you honestly believe that after Fauci negated what Trump said, that Cuomo will use New Yorkers as guinea pigs in a wide-spread trials because Trump asked him to?  

He said he was doing just that. See his speech Monday about middle. De Pleosio asked FDA to make ot available to NYC woth the caveat that patients sign waivers 

https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A2KLfSGHWnpeB9EATwdx.9w4;_ylu=X3oDMTByOHZyb21tBGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzcg--/RV=2/RE=1585105671/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fwww.thesun.co.uk%2fnews%2f11237472%2fgov-cuomo-announced-new-york-coronavirus-doctors-will-start-using-trump-backed-anti-malaria-drug-tomorrow%2f/RK=2/RS=SxhysaERoi1lLmBj4FuGiWopuFA- - https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A2KLfSGHWnpeB9EATwdx.9w4;_ylu=X3oDMTByOHZyb21tBGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDBHNlYwNzcg--/RV=2/RE=1585105671/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fwww.thesun.co.uk%2fnews%2f11237472%2fgov-cuomo-announced-new-york-coronavirus-doctors-will-start-using-trump-backed-anti-malaria-drug-tomorrow%2f/RK=2/RS=SxhysaERoi1lLmBj4FuGiWopuFA-

New York coronavirus doctors will start using Trump-backed anti-malaria drug TOMORROW LATEST Danielle Cinone 23 Mar 2020, 17:27Updated: 23 Mar 2020,

Well if it is Trump backed it will work!  LOL!   There are a lot of Doc's who think it will work too or they would not be using it!

Turbo - glad your tests for COVID-19 was negative and you didn't have it.   I suppose it was good practice, lol

Albert wrote: Turbo - glad your tests for COVID-19 was negative and you didn't have it.   I suppose it was good practice, lol

I kinda wish I had. 

Would have gotten it out of the way. 

Literally all experts, and including those on Fox news,  said Trump saying all will be back to normal by Easter  - WON"T HAPPEN. 

Trump is clearly a nutjub with his own agenda, which of course is the stock market.  

I could just picture Fauci, the WHO, and all experts, scratching their heads and thinking, is Trump for real on this one?  lol 

Trump needs the stock market bad as it WAS his only accomplishment, and he will say or do anything for it, and he really doesn't give a crap about anyone.  He's just a wacko conman.  

6 BK's in his personal life, the first Prez to ever be impeached in first term,  and lies and misleads basically on a daily basis.   

Remember last month when he said it was all a media hoax by the Dems? lol   

The guy is a plain idiot, and always with an agenda.  No wonder all of his generals quit.  

Which would be nice; assuming it did not get you out of the way too.

SheriAnn wrote: I agree with these sentiments completely. I am quite discouraged at the paranoia that some are exhibiting any time anyone says anything critical of the Trump administration. I find myself checking in less and less because there aren’t as many thoughtful posts or responses anymore. At the beginning of all of this I learned a lot from on here. And I now don’t even want to post anything because I am scared of getting yelled at for being critical of Trump or what I do post lately gets buried and no one responds. 🤷🏻‍♀️

I totally agree with you SheriAnn. I don't check as often as I used to, and I also don't read all the posts, I skim over them. So many people on here are using their love of Trump as an excuse to take offence or their dislike of him as an excuse to shout. I make a reasonable comment and no one sees it or comments on it or continues the discussion, they get right back on to discussing Trump (either for or against him) and America. As a Kiwi I'm starting to feel completely out of place here as this site has become all about America and how great it is. I feel sometimes like I'm reading lines from a movie script where America ultimately saves the rest of world. 

I suspect it is fear that is making people over sensitive or desperate to believe that America can save them all (and everyone else) and people's ability for rational and thoughtful discussion seems to have abandoned them. There's an awful lot of big talk and bravado on here these days and it is, in the whole, misplaced and mistimed. All this "they can prise it from my cold dead hands" rubbish is ridiculous. 

Right now, New Zealand is leading the charge on what a government can do to try and stop this disease but the rest of the world isn't interested or doesn't care. Today our entire country starts a four week lockdown. No schools, no work, no shopping - except supermarkets and pharmacies, no gyms, no public interaction. No inter island travel, no flights, no leaving the country, no coming in. We've all got to stay at home and only mix with the people we live with. And we're being paid to do this. It's radical, it's unprecedented and we hope it'll work. The idea is that in the next four weeks anyone with the virus will recover at home or in hospital if they need to, and in four weeks time we'll see our numbers dropping because there will have been no disease spread. 

I appreciate that the majority of people on this site are Americans but there are other countries out there too.

It’s great that NZ is taking those radical steps! Those unprecedented changes are what will help stop this. I am very disappointed that in the US we are using people as political pawns and disregarding life. It breaks my heart. I wanted to weep when I saw what the Lt Gov in Texas was saying. 

"No one reached out to me and said, 'As a senior citizen, are you willing to take a chance on your survival in exchange for keeping the America that all America loves for your children and grandchildren?' And if that is the exchange, I'm all in,"

There's a political gamble taking place in the US. There will undoubtedly be many deaths there and the gamble is how will the surviving voters react: either they will vote against Trump because they are outraged and heartbroken to have lost their parents and grandparents, or by the time the election comes round they will have reconciled themselves to their losses and be looking forward to any inheritance that this disease has freed up for them. Also the economy will undoubtedly benefit from losing a good proportion of it's elderly people. Afterall, the elderly don't work, they don't contribute to the economy very much and they don't consume very much either. Reducing this demographic will free up money, savings, and housing stock, plus it will ease pressure on health services and pension funds. 

The unpalatable truth is that the majority of the population of the Western world are increasing disenfranchised from the societies they live in and this is why we have seen such a rise in populism and radical voting (think Brexit and Trump). I suspect that Trump's gamble will pay off. By the time the people vote, the people will have come to terms with their losses and be celebrating their gains. Afterall, it's better if Uncle Bob's money comes to them rather than paying a retirement home isn't it?

KiwiMum,      I find your post tasteless and offensive. Lucky you that your government is taking every measure to protect everyone. I have a 92  yr old father that has been in isolation for three weeks, With this easing of restrictions I say to myself is this life going forward where the elderly will be marginalized to live a empty existence?  No going out without fear of contracting a deadly virus so others can enjoy life,spreading this so far and wide possibly becoming more virulent, making a vaccine will be near impossible. I am also high risk group,I am responsible for his well being,so this will also be my life,never knowing if I pick it up,afraid of passing it to my father,always starting a two week countdown everytime I go out.

Albert wrote: Trump in the briefing today said that the flu is far worse, and more people die in car accdients.    Clear White House message - is that the flu is worse and this is overblown.  Not sure what to think.  Is Trump correct, and yes he is major conman lol, but is he doing a con or is thing basically over as he claims?  Would love for this to be over as he is saying.  Any thoughts?

Sure.  This is what I think. 

a)  We have a longtime medical understanding of influenza, and its causative virus, orthomixoviridae.  Even if a new strain like H5N1 or N7N9 emerged, we would have some tools to fight it including proven and safe antivirals (Tamiflu, Relenza etc.), knowledge of vaccine production, and familiarity with flu transmission patters.  

b)  Unchaining the SARS-CoV2 virus in the USA will open the gates to hell.  It is a new virus that we have no experience with, and we don't know how many mutations it may undergo during unrestrained transmissions.  

Back in early Feb, I took pencil to paper to see how many might die.  These are my calculations:

US population is presently about 331 million souls. if about 1/3 of us are at highest risk

for serious illness, the numerator is 100 million. CFR may be 2%, so 2 million might

die from this one in the US. I think my math is correct.

I sent that to my MD contacts with the FBI, and they said it sounded right.  Later on, the Brits did          their model and said: 

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imperial-college/medicine/sph/ide/gida-fellowships/Imperial-College-COVID19-NPI-modelling-16-03-2020.pdf - https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imperial-college/medicine/sph/ide/gida-fellowships/Imperial-College-COVID19-NPI-modelling-16-03-2020.pdf

On page 7 of 20, it says:  

c)  Keep in mind, unrestrained COVID-19 would cause additional mortalities.  Hospitals would be clogged with dying corona-virus patients, so people with heart attacks etc. would be delayed from getting care.   What is happening in Italy would happen in the US, but worse, as Italy actually has more hospital beds than the US. 

Major employers will not buy into Trump's "command" to restart the economy.  We are learning to work at home, and new tools like ZOOM are helping us to remain connected and efficient.  This pandemic might spell the end of the office building and commuting, much like the Dot Com era spelled the death of the brick & mortar department store. 

As my hero, Ronald Reagan, used to intone when times got tough...."Stay the course." 

KiwiMum wrote: There's a political gamble taking place in the US. There will undoubtedly be many deaths there and the gamble is how will the surviving voters react: either they will vote against Trump because they are outraged and heartbroken to have lost their parents and grandparents, or by the time the election comes round they will have reconciled themselves to their losses and be looking forward to any inheritance that this disease has freed up for them. Also the economy will undoubtedly benefit from losing a good proportion of it's elderly people. Afterall, the elderly don't work, they don't contribute to the economy very much and they don't consume very much either. Reducing this demographic will free up money, savings, and housing stock, plus it will ease pressure on health services and pension funds.  The unpalatable truth is that the majority of the population of the Western world are increasing disenfranchised from the societies they live in and this is why we have seen such a rise in populism and radical voting (think Brexit and Trump). I suspect that Trump's gamble will pay off. By the time the people vote, the people will have come to terms with their losses and be celebrating their gains. Afterall, it's better if Uncle Bob's money comes to them rather than paying a retirement home isn't it?

Interesting analysis!  Sadly, young people will also be mowed down by the virus....we are seeing this now.  The Chinese experience didn't detect this, but perhaps the Western habits of smoking, drinking, drug use, vaping etc. among our youth is leaving them more vulnerable. 

American adults of all ages — not just those in their 70s, 80s and 90s — are being seriously sickened by the coronavirus, according to a report on nearly 2,500 of the first recorded cases in the United States.

The https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6912e2.htm?s_cid=mm6912e2_w" rel="noopener noreferrer" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border: 0px; font-family: inherit; font-size: inherit; font-style: inherit; font-variant-caps: inherit; font-stretch: inherit; line-height: inherit; vertical-align: baseline; text-decoration: underline; color: rgb(50, 104, 145); text-decoration-line: underline;" title=" - report , issued Wednesday by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, found that — as in other countries — the oldest patients had the greatest likelihood of dying and of being hospitalized. But of the 508 patients known to have been hospitalized, 38 percent were notably younger — between 20 and 54. And nearly half of the 121 patients who were admitted to intensive care units were adults under 65, the C.D.C. reported.

I think Trump's gamble is destined to fail, horribly.  When babies have to be born at home because US hospitals are full of dying COVID-19 patients, the economic gamble will not look so endearing.  Corporations won't buy into Trump's plan, it is only rich investors who are pushing him.  

Even Boris Johnson looks supremely competent to Donald Trump.  Amazing.  

That was last Monday.  After NY got shorted on Trump's promise of 4000 ventilators... don't hold your breath.  

Besides.. after what happened in Arizona, they'd be hard pressed to get the releases from patients and their families.  

Let’s all quit spreading assumptions. Trump did not say he was going to open it back up, he said he hoped we could. Easter is still longer than the 15 days they originally announced. I think everyone here knows that his job is to calm the fear, protect the stock market and provide a positive outlook instead of doom and gloom. I hope he goes by what the data is telling them then. He may also leave it to the state and locals to decide. If Trump goes against the recommendations of the experts, you know we will hear about it. 

Trump can say whatever he wants to give people hope. Hope isn't a bad thing.  When one goes in with incurable cancer, they don't say, "you gonna die"  they offer up hope.  WE ALL KNOW that things will get terribly worse and in a week or Trump so will come back and have to tell us the bad news.  Especially since more people in government will get sick and likely see deaths.  Then the shit gets real for all of them and they stop making assumptions.  Of course, hoping none of this happens.  i wouldn't mind a summer at the pool, but you won't catch me at a public gathering in the next 30 days!!

FluMom

I've been reading here for a long time and I was compelled to register because I've never read posts that infuriated me more.

You are a teacher. Well, I'm a substitute teacher. Did you know that we are ineligible for unemployment during this crisis because they are considering the summer quarter? 

But here's the thing. You want to enjoy SIP while people like me - younger people with no medical problems and who may or may not have relatives with health problems that they provide primary care for - go and fill in for people like you so you can avoid all risk and SIP.

You want this when 46 percent of people in the United States who fall seriously ill are younger, healthy people. And why do you want this? You want it so you can have and eat  3 cakes - 

1) save the legacy of a POTUS who purposefully acted to make our current situation worse

2) Avoid all your personal exposure and risk while advocating for others to take your risk

3) Do the above 2 while saving your pension.( and that being one of your biggest motivations isn't lost on anyone here )

Your selfishness is disgusting. Absolutely disgusting.

If you want to bean count lives, put yours in the pot too

Clapback you should be censured You are so off base with regards to flumom’s post. You are so rude and obviously have no clue of what flumom has on her plate at home. Being s 22 year veteran of teaching I love my subs and they are previous to the school district We are in. Just like other small business owners our board of Supervisors voted to keep them on the pay role and allow them to help keep our kids fed by paying them to man the food distributed at 90 % of our schools. Yes we have that many poor kids that count on our foods. Too bad you live in a county that isn’t that progressive. If you so resentful of our pensions and our teaching degrees why don’t you go back to school and get certified yourself!! I did reinvent myself at 32 when I had 3 babies mouths to feed due to an ill husband. Stop using this forum to vent your clearly misplaced anger

Usk wrote: Clapback you should be censured You are so off base with regards to flumom’s post. You are so rude and obviously have no clue of what flumom has on her plate at home. Being s 22 year veteran of teaching I love my subs and they are previous to the school district We are in. Just like other small business owners our board of Supervisors voted to keep them on the pay role and allow them to help keep our kids fed by paying them to man the food distributed at 90 % of our schools. Yes we have that many poor kids that count on our foods. Too bad you live in a county that isn’t that progressive. If you so resentful of our pensions and our teaching degrees why don’t you go back to school and get certified yourself!! I did reinvent myself at 32 when I had 3 babies mouths to feed due to an ill husband. Stop using this forum to vent your clearly misplaced anger

I'm not angry. I'm calling what I'm seeing.

She writes her posts, right? If she is able to write what are clearly self serving posts then the response to those posts shouldn't be silenced.

She put it out there. Not me

Usk,

Why are you assuming I have a lessor education and that I want to teach full-time? 

Both of your assumptions - assumptions you asserted with nothing to base your assumptions on and then used to strawman me in your attempt to shame me for posting - are wrong.

I sub because I enjoy being around the young. I don't need the income. I have several published books that I do very well with. Books that are selling even more copies now.

I mentioned the unemployment issue because most subs aren't in my situation and - crazy me - thought if teachers  knew, they might care and advocate for their subs. Your response solved that one for me though.

xxx

Wow Clapback and Tabatha, ya’ll are really off base here. I’ve been lurking on here for years and I’ve learned a lot from Flu Moms posts. I never took her posts as being selffish or mean. This is a forum for information on a pandemic, not a place to personally attack someone. I think you both should apologize to Flu Mom.

Techno. I did mean county because our state as a commonwealth
has a board of elected supervisors who direct the school board and handle money allocations   We teachers went to bat for all our staff and subs who would not necessarily be covered during this out of school tell June. Since we needed so much help with feeding kids we offered jobs to all of them. Even our bus drivers pick up and bring kids to get food and then take them home.  Us teachers had 19 snow days and will be excepted to teach online for the rest of the school year.  We are also expected to write and create online lessons and tests

You are all wrong I have lost a child and have a 26 year old who could die. My son is today working and being exposed...we will all be exposed to this...what you think by staying inside for 4 months you will not get this.  We will all get this it is dependent when we get this if hospitals are full or not if there are vents for you to use.  I am not a cranky old lady.  There are a lot of people who do not want to SIP think it is crazy.  I have friends my age that are going out every day to the grocery store thinking we are still normal.  WE ARE NOT NORMAL.  I Think they are NUTS going out like things are normal.

I am sorry you do not get unemployment but that is your situation don't take your frustration out on me because you lead your life like you want to.  I am not disgusting.  I am just telling you that this SIP will end sooner or later and I hope that when that happens that the hospitals are not full.  But all of that is not looking too good.  

If you do not want to work I am saying don't go to work it is your choice.  If you can't stop work like my son then you have to go to work!   I am sorry but my family has the same chance as you to get the virus.  If you young people had to live though the 1918 Spanish Flu there would be no help at all.  You are most likely younger than I am so if a vent is needed you will get it not me so I have less chance to survive this. 

I am not a teacher I am support at a school.    I am just saying if you want to work people should work after SIP is over but if you don't want to work then don't.  But if things are not better by Easter this may be a moot point they may extend the SIP.  

I am not a mean old crank, I have prepped for 14 years and my son could die just like you. He could come stay with me but is living his life...like you should live your own and make your decisions.  Like my Mama says,"Worry about what you have not what other people have."  You guys are whining because things are not like they have been for years...life is going to change and change drastically, not only deaths but financially, ability to have a house, ability to save for the future you have to sit down and figure out what you want to do in this crisis.

But calling me names may make you feel better but you need to pull yourselves up by the boot straps and figure out what you need to do for your family and yourself.  No one can do that but YOU!  What I say applies only to what I think take it or leave it,  I am not above anyone, I have just made decisions how I want to live during this time.  You don't know me or what I have been through it may have been just as bad as these times.  So grow up and get going on your life, make decisions!  Oh, I also have a 97 yr old mother with a stupid sister who thinks SIP means nothing so they are both at risk 800 miles away from me.

Pixie wrote: KiwiMum,      I find your post tasteless and offensive. Lucky you that your government is taking every measure to protect everyone. I have a 92  yr old father that has been in isolation for three weeks, With this easing of restrictions I say to myself is this life going forward where the elderly will be marginalized to live a empty existence?  No going out without fear of contracting a deadly virus so others can enjoy life,spreading this so far and wide possibly becoming more virulent, making a vaccine will be near impossible. I am also high risk group,I am responsible for his well being,so this will also be my life,never knowing if I pick it up,afraid of passing it to my father,always starting a two week countdown everytime I go out.

Pixie get over yourself. I wasn't expressing my own personal opinion but a point of view. I also have an elderly parent about whom I'm very worried. As tasteless as both you and I find the idea of economics being placed over human life, it's happening, all over the world, right now. 

This is exactly what I was talking about a few posts earlier - people taking offense where none is intended and being overly sensitive. I find your comment to me to be offensive. What is this site becoming? One where we all have to agree and walk about on eggshells for fear of upsetting some overly sensitive person who is looking for any reason to become upset and throw their toys out of the pram. I've been on this site for years and it's ticked along nicely and now it's morphed into some sort of "America is great" sycophantic fan club. 

Where has the discussion gone? Where has the voice of reason gone? Has everyone's head exploded???????????

Thanks, KiWi.  They are upset because life is going to change and that is hard on some of the younger generations.  

Usk wrote: Clapback you should be censured You are so off base with regards to flumom’s post. You are so rude and obviously have no clue of what flumom has on her plate at home. Being s 22 year veteran of teaching I love my subs and they are previous to the school district We are in. Just like other small business owners our board of Supervisors voted to keep them on the pay role and allow them to help keep our kids fed by paying them to man the food distributed at 90 % of our schools. Yes we have that many poor kids that count on our foods. Too bad you live in a county that isn’t that progressive. If you so resentful of our pensions and our teaching degrees why don’t you go back to school and get certified yourself!! I did reinvent myself at 32 when I had 3 babies mouths to feed due to an ill husband. Stop using this forum to vent your clearly misplaced anger

Usk, you're out of order censoring Clapback. He/She has every right to express an opinion on here. They may be a new member but so are you. Clapback raises some interesting points from the view of a younger person - and let's face it, there are plenty of older people on here. 

Rather than see this post as a subjective attack, why don't we try and view it objectively and start a discussion from which we all might learn something.

FluMom wrote: Thanks, KiWi.  They are upset because life is going to change and that is hard on some of the younger generations.

There seem to be very few voices of reason left on here! We need to move back to the good discussions that we all used to have where we had an opportunity to learn from each other rather than attack each other. It's stressful enough right now without members here turning on one another. I've noticed that we're less and less from the old timers on here, and more and more from new members trying to throw their weight and often newly formed opinions around. It's frustrating and infuriating. It's verging on time wasting.

Agreed!

I don't suppose any of you Yanks have watched our prime minister giving his covid19 briefs,

There is a vast differenence how both leaders are addressing this, 

I Give out PM 10 out of 10 and our opposition  party  10 out of 10 for backing PM

Aussies are pulling together, everyone is heeding the goverments advice,

Make me very Proud of my Fellow AUSSIES

And of Our Prime Minister ,

whose party I never vote for ,but at this time it's time for all to pull together,

We have been told that this is here for months....

That's the truth 

(I deleted  the end of this post,).......

Trying to stop the hurt....

Continues to imply the young of the society are the ones who need to saddle up, bury our peers, and welcome our losses as opportunity cost while the old people sit at home avoiding risk, watching Netflix, and enjoying the benefits of an economy coming back that's driven by the young dying.

And you have the nerve to say, "Ohh, they are just upset because times might be tough for them".

Not going to happen.

Get off the couch with us and toss your beans into the jar. Ohh, does the thought of the young requiring the old to roll the risk dice instead of laying on the couch until all is clear "upset" you?

Has there ever been a generation like the Boomers who, rather than wanting the young to live, are willing to toss the young into a pandemic  flooded medical system so they don't lose their investments?

These posters try to imply the young in this situation are the entitled ones. Yet they are advocating for the death of the young for the economic benefit of the old. ( Yes, it is the benefits of the old. The young have many years to invest. The old don't. These are your market losses - not ours - and you are so angst to take them that you'll toss the young into a Darwin herd immunity situation with a novel virus.

Talk about entitlement...

ClapBack wrote: Continues to imply the young of the society are the ones who need to saddle up, bury our peers, and welcome our losses as opportunity cost while the old people sit at home avoiding risk, watching Netflix, and enjoying the benefits of an economy coming back that's driven by the young dying. Not going to happen. Get off the couch with us and toss your beans into the jar.  Has there ever been a generation like the Boomers who, rather than wanting the young to live, are willing to toss the young into a pandemic  flooded medical system so they don't lose their investments? Talk about entitlement...

They took care of us. Time for us to take care of them. No offense, but you sound like someone with an inheritance coming. As a responsible X-gener, I will protect my parents at all costs from this thing. 

Inter

I'd agree if this was about saving their lives for them.

But it isn't about their lives for them.

Nope,. Read what they write. They don't write about being motivated by that. They write motivations that concern a science denying president's legacy, the market, and the economy. 

For them, it's all about saving their investments and how they are entitled to the young's last breath to save their investments.

ME163 wrote:  Clearly, trump is a moron who lies about every thing .

I just love the word moron. I should use it more.  

ClapBack wrote: For them, it's all about saving their investments and how they are entitled to the young's last breath to save their investments.

All the media is focusing on the danger to the old, when in fact there is increasing evidence to suggest that the young can be as severely affected and can die from it too. I agree that there is far too much talk of investments. You simply can't put a price on human life. And you could very successfully argue that it's more important to preserve the lives of the younger people, who may well have young children at home who need them to survive. I have two boys at home and too young to drive. I'm taking this very seriously.

interwebber wrote: They took care of us. Time for us to take care of them. No offense, but you sound like someone with an inheritance coming. As a responsible X-gener, I will protect my parents at all costs from this thing.

On the contrary, Claptrap is worried about self preservation, that's not entitlement that's common sense. As for sacrificing myself for my elderly parents - I wouldn't. And what's more, they wouldn't want me to. They've had their life and I'm in the prime of mine with children still at home who rely on me and my husband for their survival. What kind of screwed up elderly person would ask us to risk our lives for them? Only a very selfish one.

carbon20 wrote: I don't suppose any of you Yanks have watched our prime minister giving his covid19 briefs, There is a vast differenence how both leaders are addressing this,  I Give out PM 10 out of 10 and our opposition  party  10 out of 10 for backing PM Aussies are pulling together, everyone is heeding the goverments advice, Make me very Proud of my Fellow AUSSIES And of Our Prime Minister , whose party I never vote for ,but at this time it's time for all to pull together, We have been told that this is here for months.... That's the truth

Well said Carbon. NZ's prime minister is being just as responsible and the opposition is backing her to the hilt. It's time for all parties to pull together and for the populace to support them. A poll yesterday showed that 93% of Kiwis fully support the four week lockdown we're starting today. 

Thank heavens we both live in the bottom of the Southern Hemisphere - far away from the Northern hemisphere and the madness that is about to erupt there.

KiwiMum wrote: interwebber wrote: They took care of us. Time for us to take care of them. No offense, but you sound like someone with an inheritance coming. As a responsible X-gener, I will protect my parents at all costs from this thing.  On the contrary, Claptrap is worried about self preservation, that's not entitlement that's common sense. As for sacrificing myself for my elderly parents - I wouldn't. And what's more, they wouldn't want me to. They've had their life and I'm in the prime of mine with children still at home who rely on me and my husband for their survival. What kind of screwed up elderly person would ask us to risk our lives for them? Only a very selfish one.

It's not either or. I still have children at home as well, and am very worried about them, and my wife and I. We can protect those most at risk while still minimizing the risk to all of us. Like stop public shaming of wearing masks and transition to online schooling of kids. I support all these things. I'm just not a fan of saying let's sacrifice the old for the young. There needs to be a balance in all of this. Calling out Flumom to go back to work to support the economy and put "skin" in the game IMO is just mean spirited and not necessary...

FluMom wrote: I think the President is correct give it until Easter to keep people home they let the younger people go back to work with some restrictions on gathering places and businesses one rotations of some kind to keep people at a distance.  Old people and people with medical problems isolate.  That is what I am planning on until August.  Old folks home care takers use PPE to keep the old people well.  This can be done I thing by Easter too.  I am willing at 70 to stay home for the youth to go back to work!

No.  Don't forget, the medical evidence points to fecal/oral transmission as well as aerosol from close contact.  That is why the Diamond Princess cruise boat experience was so bad.  We cannot mingle exposed/incubating cases with non-immune cases.  That path is suicide.  

My colleague, Dr. Marc Lipsitch, discusses what we need to do in this article:

a) test everybody - some folks will have immunity & will be able to work immediately, some will be positive and should be quarantined until they prove recovery/immunity, and make sure that we protect the vulnerable (immune compromised, elderly etc.)

b) go slowly - pushing this outbreak will only cause much higher deaths and economic misery. 

https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/03/finding-ways-to-forge-through-the-covid-19-pandemic/?utm_source=SilverpopMailing&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Daily%2520Gazette%252020200323%2520%281%29 - https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2020/03/finding-ways-to-forge-through-the-covid-19-pandemic/?utm_source=SilverpopMailing&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Daily%2520Gazette%252020200323%2520%281%29

As the coronoavirus pandemic spreads and hunkered-down Americans wonder when and how they’ll get back on the job, a Harvard epidemiologist said a second type of test being developed could clear for work the small but rising numbers of those previously infected, and thus immune to the virus.

https://ccdd.hsph.harvard.edu/people/marc-lipsitch/" style="background-color: transparent; text-decoration-skip: objects; box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); transition: color 0.1s linear, border-color 0.1s linear; border-bottom: 1px solid var(--theme); - Marc Lipsitch , director of the https://ccdd.hsph.harvard.edu/" style="background-color: transparent; text-decoration-skip: objects; box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); transition: color 0.1s linear, border-color 0.1s linear; border-bottom: 1px solid var(--theme); - Center for Communicable Disease Dynamics at the http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/" style="background-color: transparent; text-decoration-skip: objects; box-sizing: border-box; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); transition: color 0.1s linear, border-color 0.1s linear; border-bottom: 1px solid var(--theme); - Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health , said development and use of serological testing — which is already done routinely to check exposure to other pathogens — could help identify those who may be immune.

Lipsitch, speaking in a media conference call on Friday, said there’s no reason the second wave of testing should have to wait for completion of the first round  involving people suspected of having COVID-19. Serological testing, which may be even possible to do at home, could identify those who had been infected but had mild or no symptoms. Similar tests reportedly have been performed in China and other countries, and U.S. researchers such as Florian Krammer at Mount Sinai’s Icahn School of Medicine have developed a serological test for coronavirus, though it still needs to be scaled up for mass use.

“There’s no reason why we have to wait for one [test] to do the other,” Lipsitch said. “The value would be potentially tremendous if we had a workforce that was growing as the epidemic progressed that could safely go back into various jobs — including health care workers.”

It's nothing but funny to read the insulting view of young people that FluMom ( and others ) expressed several times while she ( and they ) also tossed out the expectation that the same young that she ( and they) look down on take all of her ( and their) risk. And why? For her ( and their ) investments' sake.

Yet someone who clapbacks to that disgusting dollars-over-death hypocrisy and entitlement is the "mean-spirited" one who is motivated by "self-preservation". That's ripe. That's really ripe... 

Have you people actually read what FluMom wrote? Did you read her long admonishment of nearly facet of the youngs' lives before she tossed them on the front line for the sake of the economy?

Worse, as she advocates a policy based on the death of the young for the preservation of the economy,y, there's not even the decency of an expression of gratitude that young people would go out and support the economy/her pension and build the herd immunity she is dependent on to leave her home in the future and enjoy the investments the young would save for her. Instead her words are all condescending about the young's entitlement, lifestyles, and bad parenting skills. I mean, it's not like she doesn't make it obvious about how she feels about the very people she wants to toss into the lion's den while she watches their fight for survival on the other side of the fence. And, when ya do that, it's pretty obvious that you are looking at the people you speak about that way as worthless to the point of being expendable.

Damn, there's a lot of smelling your own farts here. ( Looking forward to reading the upcoming posts that say, "saying we"smell our own farts is so vulgar and crass" pearl clutching. But hey, that's the kind of stuff that helps you rationalize us  becoming severely ill and, in some cases, dying to save your money, right?

Trump can be bombastic, but he has a habit of being correct over the longer term. 

As much as i think he's wrong. He has some very intelligent people advising him. 

Personally I've always though of the virus as a powderpuff. I think its overblown by the media. Dont get me wrong. I know its killing people and its worse than the flu, but not much worse than the flu. 

Once again clapback tell us how you really feel’. Your personal attack on Flumom shows you have some deep seated need to vent your hurt. Just not sure this is the best place for it. Why doesn’t anyone listen to what techno is writing.   Lets focus on what the individual can do to help the situation rather then engage in generation X bashing and over 60 bashing. I want  to add that those investment  we are protecting are so that my grandchildrendonothavetogodepIntodebtfortheireducation

cobber wrote: Trump can be bombastic, but he has a habit of being correct over the longer term.  As much as i think he's wrong. He has some very intelligent people advising him.  Personally I've always though of the virus as a powderpuff. I think its overblown by the media. Dont get me wrong. I know its killing people and its worse than the flu, but not much worse than the flu.

I keep looking at the numbers and it just doesn't sit right with me - the reaction to this vs the numbers... I understand the exponential features of this, but if huge numbers are asymptomatic or really mild (and it seems like the younger you are the better chance of not being serious/deadly) then are we following 'overblown' type headlines and worrying about a disease, novel as it is/going to kill lots on first & poss. second wave...but are we reacting to overblown statistics?  Like I said, something just doesn't sit right with me about all this.  Tin foil hats get better reception??? Is Covid the scrape goat for dying world economy, or the blame for food shortages or...??? I realize this is in some ways another whole conversation (if you feel like reaction is overblown then it's not), but looking back after first wave goes through - what do you think is coming?

Interesting article on generational differences in view of Covid...

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/is-there-a-generational-divide-on-attitudes-toward-pandemic-measures-its-complicated/ar-BB11GcQ5?ocid=spartanntp - https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/is-there-a-generational-divide-on-attitudes-toward-pandemic-measures-its-complicated/ar-BB11GcQ5?ocid=spartanntp