All right- just keep an open mind. We are having to go deep to get information.

So the question is- how much of this is alarmist garbage.

I am hearing two different sides to this. In checking on this I am finding evidence to support much of what is going out. People are getting very uncomfortable.

http://revealedtruth.wordpress.com/2009/08/01/new-zealand-swine-flu-report-from-america/

As of August 1, 2009 we approach the second wave. When it hits (depending on how much the countries will respond). How are they going to respond as per what is out there in the media.

Want to hear both sides on this. If there is a clear cut proof that if we go to emergency status these measures will not be put in place- post it. If not- the information needs to continue to flow.

Medclinician

I am not posting as a supporter of this (the video site or the ideas expressed) they are here to say the public is getting confused between the data being put out and the real data of infections, deaths, and what will be our situation during a level 3 Second Wave Pandemic.

Stay calm.. but keep your eyes open and ears to the ground.

Medclinician

PMSL!!!

After the coming economic financial collapse, a state of world-wide martial law will be declared. Considering the current events which are in direct alignment with documented plans for totalitarian one-world government, (white paper plans published by the Tri-Lateral Commission, Council on Foreign Relations, and Club of Rome), martial law will be imposed without official dissent upon the various countries of the world. Martial law is military rule imposed upon civilian populations in a time of war or during a (sic) “State of Emergency”. The following elements can be expected to occur once the t.v. news anchors tell people not to panic, but that a State of Emergency has been declared due to the crash, and a (sic) temporary state of martial law has been declared, which will be rescinded once the State of Emergency has passed.

What the news people won’t tell you is that given the history of martial law, the suspension of such a draconian state is far more difficult to achieve than its original imposition. Esteemed reader, ask yourself the question, why dictator or group of dictators ever voluntarily relinquished their dictatorial powers? I’m searching really hard through the history files of the world to find out the handful of amazing people who did so. So far, all I can find is George Washington who declined being elected “King”.

Whenever the “Powers That Be” decide to impose martial law, the following items can be expected:

:1. CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS ARE ENDED-Under martial law, the U.S. Constitution is suspended and the citizens immediately lose all the protections, safeguards, and human rights guaranteed by that document. The citizens also lose every rights and privileges granted under The Bill of Rights. The constitutions of other countries will likewise be suspended with similar conditions imposed upon the citizens of those other countries.

2. CURFEW ENFORCEMENT-Anyone caught outside after curfew can be shot dead. There are no exceptions for personal emergencies unless of course, these people have some sort of official written permission or are in possession of other material which gives them a “Get Out Of Jail Free” card.

3. WRIT OF HABEUS CORPUS SUSPENDED-This means that soldiers can bust into your house, or arrest you on the street without warrants, and can throw you into prison without explanation or access to legal counsel. They can hold you there for months, even years, since there are no time limits imposed on how long you can be imprisoned.

4. PERSONAL FIREARMS WILL BE SEIZED-Armed forces can invade your home and force you to surrender any weapons you have, regardless of your constitutional right or need to bear arms for your self-defense. If you refuse, you could be shot dead in your living room, and all your possessions seized. If you’re lucky, you might just get Tasered, or butt-ended with an AK-47, to eventually wake up in a Federal Emergency Management Agency (F.E.M.A.) Detention Center with a Prison Identification Number which you will go by as a “name” instead of your old name, the one on your birth certificate.

5. PERSONAL PROPERTY CAN BE SEIZED-This means that under the excuse of “requisitioning”, soldiers can kick you out of your home, and seize both your home, all the contents inside that home, as well as any vehicles, or other items you have on your grounds. They also can claim the actual real estate of the acreage as well. If you refuse or resist in some way well….I guess you can fill in the blanks or use your imagination.

The following list of Executive Orders have already been signed by past U.S. presidents are in effect immediately upon declaration of a national State of Emergency or Martial Law:

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Executive Order 10995: All communications media will be taken over by federal authority: radio, television, websites, newspapers, even CB and Ham radio systems. Freedom of expression, otherwise known as the First Amendment will be canceled until further notice.

Executive Order 10997: All fossil fuels, related substances as well as all electrical power, both corporate as well as privately owned devices and generators will be seized by the federal government.

Executive Order 10998: All food, means to produce such food and related products and machinery, warehouses and collectives which obviously include corporate and private farms will be seized by the government. You will not be allowed to hoard food since this is regulated. If you are caught hoarding food, you could be shot dead, or perhaps you will be lucky enough to be Tasered, knocked to the ground, sent to a FEMA camp and be immediately classified as a “domestic terrorist”, otherwise known as an “Enemy of the State”.

Executive Order 10999: All modes of transportation will be placed under complete government control. Any vehicle can be seized.

Executive Order 11000: All civilians will be drafted into forced labor which the t.v. anchors will euphemistically call “volunteer labor” at a variety of designated work places or camps under federal supervision. Go watch old film reels of the slave labor images under Nazi prison camps, or if you prefer, go watch a copy of Cool Hand Luke with Paul Newman, to get a more modern updated “American flavor” of what it’s like to be part of a slave labor chain gang. Of course, you must always remember, that if you go against the Boss, you will be accused of “A Failure To Communicate.”

Executive Order 11490: Absolute dictatorial “presidential” control will be exercised over all US citizens, business as well as church institutions during a State of Emergency where martial law is declared necessary.

Executive Order 12919: At the direction of the president, this Executive Order allows various Cabinet officials  to take over all aspects of the US economy during a State of National Emergency.

Executive Order 13010: This Executive Order allows FEMA to take control over all other government agencies.

Executive Order 12656: “ASSIGNMENT OF EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS RESPONSIBILITIES” -This order allows for the declaration of a State of Emergency   during natural disaster, military attack, technological emergency, or other emergencies that seriously  threaten the national security of the United States. This order allows for total, unquestioned federal takeover of every local police enforcement agencies, as well as local price fixing and wages. It also forbids reassignment of personal financial assets within or outside of the United States.

All in all, it makes me wish I was born several hundred years in the future, because by then, we will be genetically designed to obey without question, with no personal will or identity of our own. So in that case, we won’t know what we’ve lost, because all the history books, or shall I say history “discs” will have been rewritten. Hopefully, this game plan will be abandoned, and the planned scenario will never happen to us, even though plans have been written for just such a scenario. Hopefully, the decision will be made to abandon this plan and revitalize the world economy without dramatic incident so such draconian methods are not necessary to unite all countries under the one world globalist banner. I don’t think anyone is going to resist the transition to a one world police state anyway. Most people just want to be able to pay their bills and get by, and enjoy what little free time they have, no matter what group is ruling.  After all, this transition is already being achieved as we speak.

Bandyt wrote: ya know i didn't watch the whole thing because i think the post is more consipiracy theory than truth from what i did watch. it makes sense to have enough flu at this point to make 20mil vaccines.  it takes a few months to grow it in eggs and we've known about the flu since april which means the who/nhs have known about it before then.  the company has had enough time to grow at least one batch of eggs with flu. mandatory vaccines will never occur for the general public because there will never be enough vaccine to innoculate that many people PERIOD.  it would be literally IMPOSSIBLE

Several companies are not using the egg growing technique anymore they use cell based technology. Quarantines would be attempted if you had a high concentration area heavily infected. There are laws on the books to block traffic, seal bridges, and shut down transportation facilities under martial law.

The problem is the general public has no clue as to the extreme power .gov has in a martial law situation. Although is it illegal to use military troups in a state situation, there are provisions for military troups, which will not be nice, to be used instead of militia.

It has been reasoned in the even of an extreme (a nuclear attack is imminent) thinking of the 60s that certain laws were alright. Yet these same laws are still in effect as executive orders and a Pandemic can be declared as much a national emergency as a declaration of war.

This puts the Hawks in the drivers seat and gives them great power.

This is all posted to make people, as we near the second phase, of the strangeness of prepping if the government can simply take your food and divide it as they wish for the good of all.

If you have a gun or guns in your prep they can take them. They did in Katrina. If you wish to walk after midnight or even have a bible study you could be .. harmed.

When would be the time to ammend or limit these incredible powers- before a Pandemic is declared. That would have been the time.

Medclinician

As noted above, the government does have in place the tools they need should they wish to use them. No need to discuss can they.

Hi Med! Thanks for all your doing and God Bless!


4. PERSONAL FIREARMS WILL BE SEIZED-Armed forces can invade your home and force you to surrender any weapons you have, regardless of your constitutional right or need to bear arms for your self-defense. If you refuse, you could be shot dead in your living room, and all your possessions seized. If you’re lucky, you might just get Tasered, or butt-ended with an AK-47, to eventually wake up in a Federal Emergency Management Agency (F.E.M.A.) Detention Center with a Prison Identification Number which you will go by as a “name” instead of your old name, the one on your birth certificate.

5. PERSONAL PROPERTY CAN BE SEIZED-This means that under the excuse of “requisitioning”, soldiers can kick you out of your home, and seize both your home, all the contents inside that home, as well as any vehicles, or other items you have on your grounds. They also can claim the actual real estate of the acreage as well. If you refuse or resist in some way well….I guess you can fill in the blanks or use your imagination.



If it ever gets to this point I would probably just give up..If me and my family were threatened by thugs,gangs,ect. They will have a rude awakening as I am very capable of protecting my home. On the other hand having to fire upon our own millitary/police forces? Cant see winning in that situation...Hope and pray ee never get to that point..

Johnray1 wrote: Medclinician,could it be getting clost to time for me and you to consider meeting? If you think it,we will work out something. I am fully prepared,so I actually need nothing,except that I know two small groups who are self supporting is better that two smaller groups trying to make it on their own..One of us could consider getting some sleep sometimes.The indians lived in family groups of 8 to 10 families each. **** I will just tell you my email address is    jray308us@yahool.com      If any freks or thieves want to follow this IP address,you making a major mistake.Johnray1           By the way,I have the flu now and it is not that bad.

John, I honestly believe you and I will be on the front lines in this, despite my abysmal health. Because I have had the flu 3 times- there is a fair chance I am now immune or will be and able to work among the real sickies and not catch it. Skye is totally immune as is Bluebird so far. She was with me in 2006 when I had Influenza A and they didn't want to keep subtyping it. As a doctor JohnRay you know the deal on this.

I think WV and TPTB would rather me be off the net. There are more than enough dataminers to carry the torch here, and we medical people are going to start seeing 2nd stage stuff pretty soon. Since it is possible - and the Vet hospital already is diverting huge numbers to Richmond- and Richmond is on overflow- well- smelling the coffee huh?

I do wish this site well, and I will maintain a presence here- but honestly- we need to contact X in Virginia- look at their plan and start pulling things together at a community level. This is gonna hit before I make it back to Silicon Valley.

It is getting near time for MC to go dark. We had the flu here too. There are different strains. There is one very nasty one which we got from a relative in San Antonio, Texas. I think they should use that strain for making the vaccine. It is nastier and more lethal. That's why people in Texas were dying.  Mine lasted three weeks. 5 days I was flat and lived near the bathroom. That strain comes with a really nasty GI hook. There is a new strain going through now. Its not exactly second wave but so mild people don't run fevers and spread it like crazy. This one may have a throat things hooked to it- it is basically miserable. I am immune to it- so is Skye- Bluebird not almost expriing from it in 2006 like I did, got it some to the point she was heading to the clinic. Skye was coughing. Bluebird is older now and is getting out of the main focus who get it. Grandma is in her 80s. She never even had it at all.  We will meet and what is said will stay in the room it is said in.

Medclincian

4=laro wrote: Well the bilderberg group does want the economy to crash this year, so that has to be close.  One other thing that has to be accomplished is to have people begging to be vaccinated.  If you have a large protest in say New Zealand and everyone refused to take the vaccine, and they have say a 50% death rate, or somewhere scary, wouldn't you suspect everyone in this country would be scrambling for a shot of whatever vaccine is available?  Would they even care who manufactured it or what was in it?  There would be no reason to declare Marshal Law, just put in a live virus and let it do all the work. However, on the other hand, if you have a population that is currently well armed, would you as a foreign nation want to invade?  China is not in favor of the dollar, therefore they are not friends of the federal reserve, so they would be the enemy, not the american population.  So it would be wise to use an effective vaccine on the US population and a contaminated one on the Chinese.  Their gov would crumble and this one would still be functioning and very well armed.  What do you think?

Now there's a walk in the minefield. I keep hearing about the Bilderberg group. We can start there. What is it?

Med

From what I see here (not just this thread) Med does a whole bunch of homework, as we all should.  It's not just a matter of the vaccine being distributed soon.  The other big thing coming in the October-ish timeframe is the dumping of the dollar as the worlds' value base.
As for what Med is "reading into" the info on this page, I think this thread:
http://www.avianflutalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=24355&PN=1
complements it very well.  I say hedge your bets, and firm up your disaster preps.

I think one can glean a whole lot by reading the view from the other side:
http://www.armageddonconspiracy.co.uk/
This is the Illuminati.  I've been following this site for about 10 weeks now, and have read everything that links from the left side of the page.  I still don't know if I believe that they are who they say they are, but their material is accurate, for the most part.  They have established a new political party in the UK:
http://www.meritocracy.org.uk/
Their claimed goal is to overthrow what they call the "Old World Order", which is the Bilderbergs and their ilk.  Very interesting views on the origin of religions, the current state of affairs, why we're here, and what the present world order is all about.

Sorry guys.. you know how verbal I am- the crazier than a ..... house rat I need to reply to. Can't have people identifying me like I did the video. I just put it up.

inthesticks wrote: MED, I think you are crazier than a ****house rat.  Your rantings are of a consipiracy theorist radical intent upon stirring up as much fear and panic as possible.  Where are the sources for this latest theory of yours?  Some rantings by a fellow conspiracy theorist in NZ?  Man, you need to post links to facts, not unofficial website or blog posts.  IF we all were to believe you, we would all be holed-up in our homes, popping Tamiflu and cleaning our guns...while mulling over why it is that some nefarious, government-medical community conspiracy attempts to confiscate everyone's food supplies...all sanctioned by the U.N.  Geez...get a grip.  In fact, get a life.

Warning- a long read ahead.  Med

We've posted before ITS and let me give it you  to straight on. I could write a nice fun survival book, which follows all the rules, and predicts a future which is completely unlike what it will really be like. I could be careful with everything I post so that I don't offend anyone. I could give President type speeches that have no content and when you are finished listening you say- Geez- what was that all about. The man did not take a stand on anything. I could do that. Send my book in Bantam or whatever, and make a pot load of money, setup a sanctuary for my family, and then when the Second Wave hits, sit back and watch the show. Nuh huh. I was not brought up that way. I care about other people.

Crazy is  big word. Being in medicine and also psychiatry (doing night shift running a psyche facility) you learn a lot. For me there are two types of crazy. Neurotic and Psychotic. You need to understand when you call someone crazy, delusional, nuts- often it really isn't that. It is that you feverishly disagree with their ideas which are so different than yours, when you are 'sane' that they must be mentally ill.  I have taken care of crazy people, hearing voices, swinging knives at me. And I am telling you if you think this is crazy- wait until the Pandemic. Take a person burning up with fever with a dying baby (a mother- primal bear - beware) who needs food. You do not want to even go there. Is she crazy? Well, you are gonna be pretty convinced as she jumps you, she is- but she doesn't think so. She is trying to survive.

I have worked with .gov on and off for decades. I have been on the inside. Many people I knew could not even maintain their Christianity and work for some departments or some jobs. When I worked in a jewelry store I was told to lie. Say the fake gems were real. When I worked with certain groups I was trained if asked certain questions to lie. And if officer so and so on a high speed chase through a populated area made the front page when a child was run over- the officers were told - to lie.

In a hospital when X surgeon, who we always had to take his patients back into surgery a second time because he was drunk half the time, and then the state came down to review the nurses notes, I was told to make up whole days of what happened when the shift would leave spaces in the nurses notes blank so they could 'fill them in later.'.

So, never became a really big cog in the wheel in any organization. I wouldn't even tell my secretary to tell people I was in a meeting when I was right there. It was lying. Why should I lie here to strangers, who don't even pay me anything or give me a job, when I left many positions because I refused to lie.

You have neurosis, for instance. That is compulsive stuff, weird stuff, and everyone to a certain is nuerotic about something. They get all excited a lot more than they should and then fight with others who aren't. They have pet peeves and pet beliefs and are almost religious on some things. Later they find they were wrong. They will explain this away and that is call rationalization. People get obsessed with causes, ideas, what is right and wrong, and how so and so is not going to do this to them. In every person is a wolf (Steppinwolf - Herman Hesse)

Now psychosis. There is where you hit the mother lode as far a mentally ill. But here's the catch, it is hard to tell the difference between a psychotic and someone who has be misled or actually controlled by a group or government, and simply parrots what they are programmed to believe. A true psychotic does not have the filters except to survive. They are out of touch with reality. I don't think the populace are on purpose uninformed, but I think they are uniformed.  So when you call a person crazy or delusional, you are saying a) that you must be nuts because you don't see things the way I do or b) you are out of contact with the world as it is.

The test of all of this is - reality. And part of reality- a postulate- is that any group or person  in power or control will do whatever is necessary to stay in control, and use any means to maintain the status quo, as long as they are not caught or exposed. Given the amount of power, if it is enough, it will make them bad people. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Our current financial state in the U.S.A. is a classic example of this. People had no one to control them and did whatever they could get away with. It has become what our children are learning instead of old fashioned morality- it is more - if you can do it an not get caught- then you are clever.  And society actually rewards many of these people with money you could only dream  about.

I have had this kind of money. I have been rich. Some of us, break away from working for someone else and having to be dishonest, or look the other way, and earn an honest living. Some of us earn a living. We work up to 20 hours a day, as my father did, try to raise children, pay the bills, and sometimes get to do something fun or even eat. Some of us can't. I can sympathize with that. The disabled. But I think every person should contribute to our society according the full measure of ability. If you can sit at a table and sort circuit boards, and do nothing else, the .gov should find you that company and that table, and you should contribute to society.

You have a catch 22. And no one is advocating any sort of crazy action or doing anything anti anything. The Executive Orders exist. They are a total wipe of our constitution with the justification of what used to be we were at war and such Draconian measures had to be implemented for a short time. A severe Pandemic is likely to last years. You can look at the historical models.

Currently, and this is a fact, our military are running maneuvers and drills in populated areas with helicopters and troops to prepare for civil unrest in the event of a serious hit to the infrastructure. They would not waste time or money if they did not think there was a danger of our social order disintegrating.

One woman poster put this pretty plainly. The laws are in place to completely take away our liberty as per the constitution. Once this could only happen in a war time when we were under attack. Now it has been gradually fudged until what was for war can now kick in if there is a disaster. And according to many health professionals, including Dr. Chan the head of the most important health organization in the world WHO- we are likely headed down that road- if not this winter- very soon.

65,000,000 or so voted for the present administration. 105,000,000 voted for NOTA (none of the above). Despite incredible hype, the election was not a mandate of the people. It was about one fifth who voted for the present leader and 4/5 did not.

According to our system, we acquiesce - who ever loses, shakes hands, and as citizens accept the output of our democratic system, the new administration.

There has been said hundred years of the body politick- that people are not particularly happy. Everyday I watch news programs and ready dozens of magazines and literally eat media three times a day mentally.

People and .gov are afraid.

Now - the trick here is - they can't get too afraid. No matter how bad the Pandemic or what is really happening economically we have a paper money system that floats like a kite- it has no real foundation- except for maybe the federal reserve- and even that is under attack.  If they get too afraid, then its time to print the second trillion dollars to feed the instant tellers. But then comes inflation and them comes- two years not have a nice day.

So, some guy starts reading off these executive orders and says- do you know what can happen in a Pandemic?

Well there is where I get caught in the crossfire. You see, I just wanted to put out a book what would help people survive. But now I am dragged into politics. Because as we encourage people to prep and store food, on a bad day, the government can say we need that food and just take it IF we are in a Pandemic. People buy guns to protect their families and there is an EO to take those guns as happened in Katrina.

Now, the person, like a bad guy, becomes a black hat. He is not with the program. Actually, and more head than one has fallen over this one, he is telling people the truth.  And back to our axiom or postulate- whoever in power wants to stay in power- and then change becomes the enemy, unless...to get in power someone promises change.

Yep, the true fruit loops exist out there who want to rule the world and form organizations and see vast plans for a world government. The very word world government is poision isn't it. There was a time that national government was poison and still, still after hundreds of years the states and feds are fighting for power and money.

I saw a video. I put it up. I am not the leader of a movement and I don't have the answers as to when you have the right to have a weapon and someone under law can take it from you- and you give it up and are defenseless. Leave that one for our leaders. Ask them. I didn't start the fire, and I won't be able to put it out. (song)

We had people waving around guns at police officers in San Jose. My dad was a friend of the chief of police. This one guy was in his room with a squirt gun and they opened fire on him and he was killed. It was a misunderstanding. The order was shoot to kill, not disable, not maim, execute.

My point and in my book. I suggest moving away from populated areas where there is no heavy .gov and lots of crazy people with guns, hungry and desperate and nuts. There will still be some, but .gov is likely to be more concerned with fighitng for home turf and big cities. We small towners aren't going to be numero uno on the prioirity list.  It is unlikely many will be picked up shoved into a camp, or made to work, or stripped of their homes and made to live in a stadium.  It is unlikely, but not impossible. That is reality.

But the laws are there. They can do it if they want to. IMHO perhaps these type of laws should be reserved for cataclysmic situations. If you will look at the Black Death with 50% mortality in some places 9general population) - and I have posted diaries the .gov continued to function.

So I hope they will continue to function, even though I have grumbles for a lot of programs and a lot of policies. Don't we all.

During a Pandemic- they may cease to be grumbles. Don't set me up to be a crazy person. I am a pragmatist. My thinking and logic is based on experience and reality. What is and history.

I was going to start a whole thread on delusional. People use the word a lot. Many times it is synonymous with you don't agree with me. You don't accept MY reality on how things are so you must be - crazy.

How crazy. Dangerous crazy. Or just lets ruin credibility so when the truth is put out there, people will be so fixed on the messenger they won't hear the message.

No easy answers. You all come up with them. I am wrting about how dig a latrine, or what material to use for diapers, and even list the guns, 3, I would have during a Pandemic. I think there is kind of a general agreement on what type of guns to have and experts can go into this pretty deep. I am more into water and food that doesn't spoil and getting away from the cities. .gov wants everyone to SIP. I was told by a friend in places- head for the ocean- camp by it and live of it.

If you want to silence a voice, especially a voice that tells the truth, make them the enemy. Tell people they are crazy, destroy credibility, call them delusional, and above all never address the truth of what is being said. I do not know how our government will handle the power given them by the executive orders. We have had eight years of what some consider the abuse of power. Now we have a new administration and it is up to them to use their power to help us and not abuse it.  Pretty simple to me.

Watch for these techniques. They have been used for centuries. I, though, am more like you, most of you I think. I love my family, I want them to make them through this, and I hope .gov will play nice.

Some do want panic. I think it gives them an adrenaline rush, like people watching a fire or the gore of an automobile accident. I am not one of those people. My friends have on the suits and are going into the fire to rescue people, I am at the scene of the accident trying to save lives.

aside: John Ray - I concerned about your flu. I feel in 3-6 weeks we are going to get hit with the second wave. People are totally unable to predict how they will react to stuff. They often think-yea this is how it will be - well at accident scenes I have seen the same people in shock wandering around bleeding and clueless.

Lets hope there will be some of us out there to help them.  By the way it is the nature of the medium. I write books. It is hard to write posts.

Medclinician

Johnny Ray and John A both please keep up with me here in Florida. Elained2 @aol.com.

Medclinician wrote: Currently, and this is a fact, our military are running maneuvers and drills in populated areas with helicopters and troops to prepare for civil unrest in the event of a serious hit to the infrastructure. They would not waste time or money if they did not think there was a danger of our social order disintegrating.

Med your conspiracy theories never end but I do see more military activity here.

My House is bordering the Camp Pendleton Marine Corps Base. I'm close enough to watch the mortars toss up dirt as they strike. For the last 6 weeks the artillery and small arms fire has increased big time. Normally they stop firing at night but now it runs all hours of the night. They upped their activity 5 fold recently.

I don't see more helicopter maneuvers compared to other years and I've watched this for 30 years. I've been on the base several times this last month. It might be related to all the troops being pulled out of Iraq or it could be that they are just using the area close to my house more. I've talked to at least 50 marines and none of them are thinking anything is up. My other House is next to the Edwards Air Force Base. I'll check into that when I go up in a week or two.

Just today on local news the national guard was dong exercises by a highway close to the city....yeah they are training the military. They called it a mass casualty training.

Johnray1 wrote: Medclinician,I have the flu now.It start day before yesterday and I jusy ignored it,but after yesterday and this morning,there is no doubt.But as the CDC says and also because I am not working right now,I will not test,I will just assume that it is the H1N1.So in a week or two,I should be well and immune.If this is the H1N1,so far,this is the mildest flu that I have ever had,I know that it could get worse,but it has not,yet.So far,my total medications taken,is two ASA.I may take two more today.Johnray1

Being a doctor, and I say this in all seriousness, you should know. I have spoken with persons in 'places' who have had this 3-4 times. Considering the importance of their work and responsibility- they simply stay home- they do not go to hospitals- and triage wise unless it is life threatening- there is more risk of catching something at a hospital than at home. If you didn't have it before, go to ER, and your odds go way up of catching it.

The strain we had, the second one was bad. Everyone infected were flat in bed for 5 days, and it was miserable. You are lucky. It is likely we caught this from San Antonio, Texas (visitor) it is possible we were immune to the first wave of what went through Mexico, and you have may have a blessing in disguise. An antibody titer to what will soon be here in Second Wave.

John A. RN- West Virginia

4=laro wrote: Bilderberg group are considered the elite of the world.  They meet yearly and seem to be able to pick our next president and control our economy.  They would probably be considered the force behind the New World Order.  They are in favor of the population control.  Seem to have the media 100% under their control.  In other words, they are controling the world thru the media.  Just google them, you won't find much since they are a secret organization.

What is ironic, is sometimes fiction parallels reality. The China Syndrome movie
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_China_Syndrome. The film was shot and the script written BEFORE the 3 Mile Island disaster. Did someone know something?

with an urgent reporter, Jane Fonda (who else huh on such a topic) and Jack Lemmon as the inside engineer desperately trying to warn of a nuclear accident was later followed by Three Mile Island,

http://www.nrc.gov/reading-rm/doc-collections/fact-sheets/3mile-isle.html


and after that Chernobyl.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernobyl_disaster

The parallel analogy here is that we have more than enough historical Pandemics and with a little artificial intelligence and chaos logic, we can follow the butterfly wing to homebase on this one.

It doesn't take a brain surgeon.

As to Bilderberg we can go to the Omen Part III - which reflects an organization called THORN - http://www.zazzle.com/thorn_industries_coffee_mug-168230569589648333

Using another engine- there are a lot of links to this. One favorite reading spot for some of those interested in alternate viewpoints is the motherlode of bb conspiracy

http://www.prisonplanet.com/archive_bilderberg.html

comment: looks like the motherload link just died.. so here is an alt- maybe its just.. busy
http://tinyurl.com/387rl6

Currently the National Enquirer has not been banned from the supermarkets or the Sun in U.K. so this does have the distinct essence of tabloid, but the concept is intriguing.

Here for contrapoint is a debunker site of this

http://www.adl.org/rumors/bilderberg.asp

Deriving its name from the Dutch hotel where it first met in 1954, the Bilderberg group is an actual, legitimate entity whose members consist of approximately 100 influential European and American figures in politics, business and academia who meet annually to discuss and advocate political, diplomatic and economic policies.

comment: one thing- aside from totally avoiding names dropped as belonging to this group- is the lack of data in the debunking article other than proving their is a real group with that name which meet and discuss world politics and may have a fair amount of influence.

Probably for the sake of general of information and one should consider my ancestors mostly (except Cherokee) came from U.K. I have a bit of the Brit in my veins- and so place a moderate amount of credibility in the final analysis here...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/3773019.stm

Medclinician

Medclinician,I finally got the feed back that I have been waiting on about the problem in New Zealand.This is from a very reliable source. There is a lot of Swine Flu In New Zealand and there are many very sick people. I also found out there in and has been a vaccine that is suppose to be safe. The government of NEW Zealand is trying to give this vaccine to the people .They are refusing it because they are afraid of it.But there is stay off with guns or any gun play of any kind by the government or the people. Johnray1   

 

I can understand accidents... but this below... is why it is so iffy in peoples minds.  Many would rather stay in control of their own bodies.... horrors :)

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Last December, the Austrian branch of Baxter sent a batch of ordinary human H3N2 flu, altered so it could not replicate, to Avir Green Hills Biotechnology, also in Austria. In February, a lab in the Czech Republic working for Avir alerted Baxter that, unexpectedly, ferrets inoculated with a sample from the shipment had died. It was discovered that the sample contained live H5N1, which was to be used by Baxter to make vaccine. Baxter claims the two mixed by error, and called the incident a simple "accident".

 

 

 

in full here-

Letter Sparks Investigation of Baxter Vaccine by New Zealand Minister of Health

Wednesday, July 08, 2009 by: Barbara Minto

 

http://www.naturalnews.com/026571_Baxter_New_Zealand_health.html

 

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Johnray1 wrote: Medclinician,I finally got the feed back that I have been waiting on about the problem in New Zealand.This is from a very reliable source. There is a lot of Swine Flu In New Zealand and there are many very sick people. I also found out there in and has been a vaccine that is suppose to be safe. The government of NEW Zealand is trying to give this vaccine to the people .They are refusing it because they are afraid of it.But there is stay off with guns or any gun play of any kind by the government or the people. Johnray1

It has been difficult to verify numbers. We have a poster from New Zealand that has said it was fairly widespread there (the flu). The absolute missing piece of data, and I have combed the net with everything I have at my disposal, is a reliable death rate which indicates it is a serious threat. I have a considerable amount of search capability.

Irregardless of the incredible spread and even fairly large infection rate, There is only one strain I have heard of that is fairly deadly. It runs about a six day course and goes from a normal healthy person to respiratory collapse and respirator which usually end in death.

There were several doctors posting or communicating on having had patients with this strain. Before anyone jumps on this, it all needs to be documented and we need to get some links and numbers. Most infections, and this really means most, are mild and some are so mild people don't even know they are sick.

It is spreading through China, but after a two day window of information that info leak is sealed shut.

Have you heard of this strain? These people taking vaccine which is more risky than the virus is really sad.  Maybe one cannot be named source at DHS or CDC- who said the fatalities that could be caused by a panic are currently worse than if everyone had the disease, was right.

We need to keep the mortality rate as the key factor in this. As one video I was sent, the deaths from TB in one area in one period were 10x those or more than from the flu. We have widespread very lethal diseases worldwide that dwarf what Swine Flu has been able to do so far.

Medclinician is a lot more of a pragmatist than some people realize. I am looking at deaths versus infections as what will set a level 3 and give us something to truly consider a problem.

Medclinician

sounds like the strain that is occurring in Brasil. Six days rapid decline and if you survive, a six week recovery and permanent lung damage

Medclininian,I got feed back from NEW Zealand.It came back a little faster than I thought that it would.This is not much,but it is all that I can get,right now. The total Death toll as of JULY 9TH is 5.Possible news black out since then.---Possible out break of Pnemonic Plague.Death rate from this disease from first Pnemonic Plague bactereia in the lungs to death is 2 to 4 days.Death Rate is near 100%,unless correct  treatment is started as some as infection is suspected.Johnray1  

Medclinian,I would rather be called up back to the Army and sent to Afgahistan,than to face what could be cooking here.But we will all do what we have to do.---When the people that I asked about New Zealand,could not get up to minute infromation from New Zealand,there is something wrong either there or here.These people that I asked to get this information are the best and they could get basically nothing. Johnray1

medclinician try this one please elained2@AOL.COM. John and I wondered why we had not heard from you